Godox AD200

Well that is my sample arrived to play with, feels really solidly built and 500 full power flashes from that little battery seems amazing

Mike
You doing a video review Mike ?
 
I'm desperately trying to be good and wait until the NEC. Have a play and make an informed decision rather than bash in my credit card number now.

For me this could be a flexible solution. Currently I carry 2xTT600's for lighting reception rooms and a AD360 for wedding portraits.

My idea is that I could replace the TT600's and the AD360 with 2x AD200. Combined it would give me more power than the AD360 and would save the amount of space I need to cart kit around.
 
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8oheDUxVxM


Look from 3:01

Seems a little low! Unless he meant 500

Ah, what he means there, though it's not at all clear, is how many consecutive full-power pops before the over-heat kicks in and extends the recharge time to 10 secs. Nothing to do with battery capacity (y)

This is a limitation with all speedlites that have no active cooling system and get very hot around the flash tube. It's detailed in the manual here, p19 http://www.yangwuonline.com/Website PDF/A-030501-PIKA200/PIKA200-MANUAL-WEB.pdf though actually that's not very clear either, saying 100 pops in the text and then 40-60 pops in the table according to the head fitted. The latter sounds much more realistic compared to other high power speedlights. Lowering the power output significantly reduces over-heating.
 
I'm not at all sure that the AD200 will be a game changer - what exactly does it offer that existing products don't?

It may not be a game changer but it does rather make the big corporations look like they've been asleep behind the wheel for a couple of decades.
 
I also think the AD200 is a potential game-changer, if Godox develops it's 'modular' aspects as I (and others) hope they might.

Instead of different standalone units for different tasks (eg speedlites, studio heads, battery/location lights etc) with different power outputs and flash tubes, and all using different remote control systems, there would be just one basic 'power/generator unit' and one common remote control/trigger. You would then clip together one or more power units according to task, attach the most appropriate flash tube, fit the right battery (or mains). The modifier mount could also become a separate module, housing a bright modelling lamp with its own power supply.

If something along these lines is anywhere in Godox's long term vision, then that would certainly be a game-changer. The AD200 looks like it could be a big first step in that direction.

Much more on 'game-changing' concepts on FlashHavoc, including some mocked-up visuals http://flashhavoc.com/cordelss-flash-concepts/

FWIW, I think it's a well considered overview of how flash units might evolve in a radically different modular direction. And there's nothing really new here in terms of technology, it's more a repackaging of what we already have. Looks good to me (y)
 
@HoppyUK

I just carried out some tests using a S70 Speedbox from SMDV and metered at 2 metres on a Sekonic 858. ISO100 and at 1/125 and 1/8000

V860II
1/125 f6.3 decimal 2
1/8000 f0.5 decimal 1

AD200
1/125 f9 decimal 0
1/8000 f0.56 decimal 3

AD360II
1/125 f11 decimal 0
!/8000 f0.8 decimal 1

AD600
1/125 f12.7 decimal 1
1/8000 f1.1 decimal 0

Just need to work out the stops differences at 1/8000

Mike
 
@mike weeks i was wondering, did the ad200 you received kit come with the wee barndoors and filters accessories that ive seen in some of the photos, or was it just the basic light by itself.
 
I just repeated the tests using an 8" reflector with front diffusorand metered at 2 metres on a Sekonic 858. ISO100 and at 1/125 and 1/8000

V860II
1/125 f1 decimal 0
1/8000 f0.8 decimal 0

AD200
1/125 f14 decimal 0
1/8000 f1 decimal 1

AD360II
1/125 f12.7 decimal 3
!/8000 f1 decimal 1

AD600
1/125 f20 decimal 0
1/8000 f1.6 decimal 3

Not 100% happy so will rerun at some stage

Mike
 
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Not sure what I'm supposed to get from this Mike. The f/numbers don't make much sense. What are you wanting to show, and how are you doing it?

When comparing speedlights and bare-bulbs flashes, a medium size softbox is best, double-diffuser, speedlight on widest zoom setting (without wide-panel), distance 1m. Greater distances increase the risk of environmental factors skewing things, and reduce brightness to marginal levels at lower power settings.
 
Not sure what I'm supposed to get from this Mike. The f/numbers don't make much sense. What are you wanting to show, and how are you doing it?

When comparing speedlights and bare-bulbs flashes, a medium size softbox is best, double-diffuser, speedlight on widest zoom setting (without wide-panel), distance 1m. Greater distances increase the risk of environmental factors skewing things, and reduce brightness to marginal levels at lower power settings.


OK, will re-test at 1m, soft box is double diffused 70cm diameter, zoom was at widest - I am confused with the low f numbers at 1/8000

Mike
 
Mike, what the heck are those f/numbers?

Can't you set the meter to give whole stops plus decimal? Eg by my reckoning, and if I'm guessing right, then f/12.7 d1 is more commonly known as f/11 d4. And f/18 d2 is f/16 d5, making a difference of 1.1 stops (not 1.4).

Purley guessing again, but your HSS numbers could be there or thereabouts. You're in HSS mode and losing a couple of stops straight off, and then you've ramped the shutter speed up six stops. Only one thing for it, fit your f/0.5 lens and see if the exposure is right ;)
 
@HoppyUK


So a re-test measuring at 1m, meter on full stops

V860II
1/125 f11 decimal 4

AD200
1/125 f16 decimal 3
so 9/10 stops greater than V860II

AD360II
1/125 f16 decimal 7
4/10 stops greater than AD200

AD600
1/125 f22 decimal 1
4/10 stops brighter than AD360II
8/10 stops greater than AD200

Whilst chatting with Edward Tang the owner of Cheetahstand last night he said that they have said the bulb position on the AD600 is all wrong and that if it could be brought maybe 1/2" to 3/4" forward then it would appear much brighter, he thinks it is losing power in the collar of the Bowens adapter. Applying that to the other lights then some tuning needs to occur to find the sweet spot for power.

Mike
 
@HoppyUK


So a re-test measuring at 1m, meter on full stops

V860II
1/125 f11 decimal 4

AD200
1/125 f16 decimal 3
so 9/10 stops greater than V860II

AD360II
1/125 f16 decimal 7
4/10 stops greater than AD200

AD600
1/125 f22 decimal 1
4/10 stops brighter than AD360II
8/10 stops greater than AD200

Whilst chatting with Edward Tang the owner of Cheetahstand last night he said that they have said the bulb position on the AD600 is all wrong and that if it could be brought maybe 1/2" to 3/4" forward then it would appear much brighter, he thinks it is losing power in the collar of the Bowens adapter. Applying that to the other lights then some tuning needs to occur to find the sweet spot for power.

Mike

Good work Mike (y)

I think suspicions around the depth of S-type/Bowens mounts are well founded. I use Elinchrom :D which is much wider (you can squeeze two speedlights inside) and less deeply recessed, so no problems there. I have S-type and Elinchrom softbox adapters in front of me now and the S-type is 18mm deeper and 20mm narrower diameter. This will absolutely make a difference. And just quickly comparing pictures of the AD600 vs other S-type heads, you can see the problem that Edward Tang refers to. In the interests of compactness, it looks like Godox have just bolted an S-type mount to the AD600 without adjusting the flange-back distance accordingly.
 
I have a few more tests that I want to carry out, first compare the AD200 to the AD360 with the AD-S7 multi softbox which is designed for the small godox mount

Secondly I have ordered an AD-S6 umbrella reflector to try mounting it into a bowens fit softbox to see what that does.

Mike
Good work Mike (y)

I think suspicions around the depth of S-type/Bowens mounts are well founded. I use Elinchrom :D which is much wider (you can squeeze two speedlights inside) and less deeply recessed, so no problems there. I have S-type and Elinchrom softbox adapters in front of me now and the S-type is 18mm deeper and 20mm narrower diameter. This will absolutely make a difference. And just quickly comparing pictures of the AD600 vs other S-type heads, you can see the problem that Edward Tang refers to. In the interests of compactness, it looks like Godox have just bolted an S-type mount to the AD600 without adjusting the flange-back distance accordingly.

I reckon that if they will supply me with the bulb mount I could build a test piece to improve performance.

Mike
 
Whilst chatting with Edward Tang the owner of Cheetahstand last night he said that they have said the bulb position on the AD600 is all wrong and that if it could be brought maybe 1/2" to 3/4" forward then it would appear much brighter, he thinks it is losing power in the collar of the Bowens adapter. Applying that to the other lights then some tuning needs to occur to find the sweet spot for power.
I think the "APPEAR much brighter" is relevant, but also potentially misleading. When combined with the right *reflector*, moving the bulb forward can concentrate the light. I.e. if you move the source farther from a parabolic reflector it concentrates/focuses the light, and if you move it closer to the reflector it spreads the light.

But if not matched to the right reflector size/shape it will not necessarily work that way. And I'm less certain of the benefit/effect when using a softbox... I think it would be a matter of "evenness" rather than significant power/brightness.
 
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I think the "APPEAR much brighter" is relevant, but also potentially misleading. When combined with the right *reflector*, moving the bulb forward can concentrate the light. I.e. if you move the source farther from a parabolic reflector it concentrates/focuses the light, and if you move it closer to the reflector it spreads the light.

But if not matched to the right reflector size/shape it will not necessarily work that way. And I'm less certain of the benefit/effect when using a softbox... I think it would be a matter of "evenness" rather than significant power/brightness.

I know where you're coming from Steven, but I think parabolic references are way off beam (haha) in 95% of all situations - basically all bar proper parabolic reflectors with adjustable focus positions. Everything else we use with claimed parabolic magic, is so far from true parabolic in just about every dimension that it can be pretty much discounted, but then Mike has not one but two diffuser panels in the softbox anyway, completely deleting any parabolic effect, real or imagined.

The only way to measure true total brightness is to collect all the light, scramble it and project it evenly so it can be accurately measured. Any double-diffuser softbox fits that bill pretty well. Or to put it another way, my test rig is rather more complicated and is very robust in terms of providing a level playing field for all types and fittings of flash unit, but in this case I doubt that it would show any difference to Mike's result - with the notable and very real exception of the AD600 and its recessed S-type mount issue.
 
I have a few more tests that I want to carry out, first compare the AD200 to the AD360 with the AD-S7 multi softbox which is designed for the small godox mount

Secondly I have ordered an AD-S6 umbrella reflector to try mounting it into a bowens fit softbox to see what that does.

Mike


I reckon that if they will supply me with the bulb mount I could build a test piece to improve performance.

Mike

I'm sure Godox is fully aware of this issue. As I recall, the AD600 was originally launched with its own proprietary mount. Then following a howl of protests they quickly added a Bowens S-type option with a quick fix that now looks a bit half-baked.

If I compare my Bowens lights with the AD600 it is easy to see a difference in positioning and also the Bowens has a built in back reflector

Yes, the problem is easy to see in any photos on the AD600 compared to other S-fit heads, including Godox's own.
 
I know where you're coming from Steven, but I think parabolic references are way off beam (haha) in 95% of all situations

Perhaps the reference to "parabolic" is misleading... all reflectors behave basically the same (the specific curvature is more a refinement on maximum efficiency for a specific result).

I'm still not convinced in terms of the AD600's recessed mounting... where is the light *loss*? Maybe a slight bit in the non reflective collar... which I estimate would mostly be adjacent to the bulb stems (not a major contributor).

AD600-BOWENS-2.jpg


In your softbox scenario I rather doubt the mounting would create a measurable difference. I do think it will probably make a notable difference in the efficiency/pattern with reflectors.
 
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So, how is the AD200 @mike weeks,well built? Display easy to read? Etc...No idea what those numbers meant so is there much power difference between the 360ii and the new AD200.
 
So, how is the AD200 @mike weeks,well built? Display easy to read? Etc...No idea what those numbers meant so is there much power difference between the 360ii and the new AD200.

Feels like it is built like the proverbial brick outhouse, display is OK but nothing exceptional- will run another test very soon comparing the 2, just remember mine is not a production run model so things may change

Mike
 
So a quick using the AD-S7 muti function softbox that is designed to fit on both the AD360 and AD200

Using the deflection plate and the diffusion covering

AD200 f11.4
AD360II f16.2

So 8/10 stops which is an increase from the SMDV S70 I tested before which makes me think that placement of the light in the modifier is absolutely critical

Mike
 
Point with the AD-S7 is that you would hope that Godox have it fit in the optimum position

Mike
There's one way to know... point it at a wall About 3ft away w/o the diffusion; if the pattern is not even then it's not right. I have one I bought a while ago but I have yet to use/test it.
I don't know how to empirically test the bowens mount softbox other than making a bulb spacer (which wouldn't be all that difficult).
 
Perhaps the reference to "parabolic" is misleading... all reflectors behave basically the same (the specific curvature is more a refinement on maximum efficiency for a specific result).

I'm still not convinced in terms of the AD600's recessed mounting... where is the light *loss*? Maybe a slight bit in the non reflective collar... which I estimate would mostly be adjacent to the bulb stems (not a major contributor).

AD600-BOWENS-2.jpg


In your softbox scenario I rather doubt the mounting would create a measurable difference. I do think it will probably make a notable difference in the efficiency/pattern with reflectors.


The tube minus pins is about 75mm long of which nearly 50mm is located within the collar of a bowens mount of the SMDV S70 I was testing with. You can clearly see the screws holding the plate that has the the pin sockets, having had one of these apart I should easily be able to test by putting longer screws in and some tube behind the plate to act as spacers. Also need to check if the SMDV has a longer throat than most.

Mike
 
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Perhaps the reference to "parabolic" is misleading... all reflectors behave basically the same (the specific curvature is more a refinement on maximum efficiency for a specific result).

I'm still not convinced in terms of the AD600's recessed mounting... where is the light *loss*? Maybe a slight bit in the non reflective collar... which I estimate would mostly be adjacent to the bulb stems (not a major contributor).

AD600-BOWENS-2.jpg


In your softbox scenario I rather doubt the mounting would create a measurable difference. I do think it will probably make a notable difference in the efficiency/pattern with reflectors.

We're all guessing here ATM, but it does look as if the AD600BM is down on expected brightness and it's certainly true that the flash tube sits much further back into the mount than it should, kind of firing out of a tunnel. FWIW, my thinking is that the mount is blocking some of the light, but also in a double-diffuser softbox a lot of light is bounced straight back towards the flash tube where it gets tangled up and absorbed by the mechanism and lost down the tunnel, IYSWIM.

Perhaps along the same lines, when you fire a speedlight into a double-diffuser softbox, extending the zoom head setting not only increases the hotspot, but also actually reduces brightness. Guessing again, but maybe there's something similar going on there.
 
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