Image quality question

Box Brownie said:
The D5600 and the 150-600mm will have most of its weight 'well forward' so just how are you supporting that weight? And how does it differ to the way you held the P900?

FWIW though many years ago (long after I started photography) I also did archery with 100lb pull simple bows and I have done .22 shooting so learnt the techniques of breath and muscle control. Without knowing that you are indeed holding the camera proficiently again I say prove the body & lens combo is fine or not before you blame it and not user error.
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I trust you on this one, the combo is front-heavy and I really hope it's user error and inexperience. 100lbs bows,what the h***? :) I have two Bowtech, one 60lbs and one 70lbs.
 
In regard the OS on the Sigma and VR on the P900

I cannot comment on the P900 but with the Canon and its IS system there is a a slight lag in the IS settling down following the initial shutter press plus if you do not hold the half press the IS will stop. Does the Sigma and Nikon do it in a similar manner, as such are you inadvertently introducing another factor into mix by use & technique?

PS do please check what the Sigma lens instructions say about if you need to turn the OS off when used on a tripod ;)
 
Box Brownie said:
But please also remember that the native sensor effect on the P900 in regard to DoF even if you shoot at the same aperture.......................the P900 will always for any given aperture have greater DoF than the D5600 at the same settings, this is because of the smaller P900 sensor.

Oh, how ever you process also remember the P900 is doing incamera processing to make the JPEG and even if you set the D5600 to JPEG you have no way of knowing how different the processing will be and how it affects the final image.
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I will set both to JPEG FINE, it's the closest I can get, they are both Nikon and neither is old.
 
heron_AI said:
I trust you on this one, the combo is front-heavy and I really hope it's user error and inexperience. 100lbs bows,what the h***? :) I have two Bowtech, one 60lbs and one 70lbs.
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They were, if I recall, wood laminate approx 5 foot long unstrung and manually strung before use (that was an art in itself) with no sights. Was great fun back in the school days late 60's to early 70's, we were in the London schools competition one year..........think we came team third and one of our team came individual first. Never did it again after leaving school ~ heh ho life moves on :LOL:
 
Box Brownie said:
In regard the OS on the Sigma and VR on the P900

I cannot comment on the P900 but with the Canon and its IS system there is a a slight lag in the IS settling down following the initial shutter press plus if you do not hold the half press the IS will stop. Does the Sigma and Nikon do it in a similar manner, as such are you inadvertently introducing another factor into mix by use & technique?

PS do please check what the Sigma lens instructions say about if you need to turn the OS off when used on a tripod ;)
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I use back-button focusing since I'm already in love with that technique. I know that Nikon says to turn off image stabilization onthe P900 if used on tripod. Not sure about Sigma, I use standard mode, but I will shut it off anyways. Regarding the Sigma lens, this is copied from http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Sigma-150-600mm-f-5-6.3-DG-OS-HSM-Contemporary-Lens.aspx:

Image Stabilization
Optical stabilization can greatly increase the versatility of most lenses, and when the focal length increases to 600mm, especially on an APS-C body, OS can save the day by virtue of the stabilized viewfinder alone. Framing a subject properly at 600mm handheld requires steady arms, but OS reduces the steadiness requirement to include a much greater segment of the photographer population. Sigma has not published the optical stabilization system rating for this lens, but I would be surprised to learn of a less-than-four-stop rating being introduced today.

With good form and stable footing, I could get mostly-sharp handheld results down to 1/15 second at 150mm (using a full frame DSLR) for about 3 1/3 stops of assistance over handholding a 150mm focal length in general. The keeper rate quickly dropped at longer exposure durations and beyond 1/10 second exposures, a very low percentage of images were sharp. One image in 16 was sharp at 1/5 second.

Longer focal lengths with their greater magnification require faster shutter speeds to deliver sharp handheld results than their wider angle counterparts do. At 600mm, the 150-600 Contemporary gives me mostly sharp handheld results down to 1/50 second for about 3 2/3 stops of assistance. The keeper rate was about 75% at 1/40 with sharp images captured sporadically at longer exposure times.

As is common for stabilized telephoto lenses, the Sigma 150-600 features mode 1 (normal) and mode 2 (panning) options. Using the Sigma Dock, this lens' OS can be further configured to one of three settings described by Sigma as:

Dynamic View Mode – This mode offers a recognizable OS effect to the image in the viewfinder. This helps to ensure the composition of images quickly.

Standard – This is the default setting. The OS effect is well-balanced and suitable for various scenes.

Moderate View Mode – This mode offers an excellent compensation of camera shake, and achieves very smooth transition of the image in the viewfinder. The composition of the image remains natural even when the angle of view keeps changing.

The lens comes with "Standard" selected by default. I primarily used Standard mode for my testing (and off while shooting sports), but I prefer Dynamic View Mode for subjects that are not moving quickly.

Some clicks are heard at OS startup and shutdown, but the operational hum is quiet. There is sometimes a small amount of jumping seen at OS startup and shutdown and subject framing drifts a small amount during OS operation (turn off OS when using a tripod). The end results from this lens' stabilizer are good – OS is an important feature for this handholdable long lens.
 
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Box Brownie said:
Handholding?

Ah! found one link with some nice pictures showing what I mean when using longer focal length lenses.

https://photographylife.com/tips-on-photographing-hand-held-with-telephoto-lenses

Does this help and is that what you have been doing?
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That is how I hold my camera, not sure about the posture since the terrain varies and it's is hard to know without someone observing you. Note sure about breathing either since I haven't been thinking about it, will check next time I go out. I wasn't aware about image stabilization settling time. Many small birds jump around a lot and since I use back-button focus I'm not sure how that translates to half-depressed shutter, anyway I'm aware that my technique is poor. Before moving on I will do some testing on tripod just to be sure it's just me.
 
Colouration differences, the two photo’s yes, the different light situations will have an impact, but also what picture style is your D5600 set to…. This can have an impact, a lot of my wildlife photography I set my picture style to landscape, as it tends to give me richer colours.

Focusing issues,

This could be the actual setting of the focus, I have mine set to Al-servo, not sure what the Nikon version is called. Also, your frame rate could also not be helping meaning that your focus success rate is going to be lower than using a camera with an higher frame rate.

Also what focus points are you using, I normally use a single point, even using a small cluster can cause the focus to shift enough to ruin what you shooting.

I actually use a Tamron version of your lens, and I find that if I extend out to 600mm it can be soft on focus, so I extend out, then a slight twist back which for my lens has made a big difference, perhaps worth trying with your sigma lens.


The tripod…

I don’t actually use a tripod, did try one at first, but well very bulky to carry, and often impractical to set up either in the hide, or an where you’ve found your spot to wait…

But I have just started to use a monopod, combined with a gimbal head, and was blown away with how much difference this has made with my IQ…. I do leave my VC on, as my thoughts are, I’m still holding the camera and moving it around….
 
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Ellie Jones said:
Colouration differences, the two photo’s yes, the different light situations will have an impact, but also what picture style is your D5600 set to…. This can have an impact, a lot of my wildlife photography I set my picture style to landscape, as it tends to give me richer colours.

Focusing issues,

This could be the actual setting of the focus, I have mine set to Al-servo, not sure what the Nikon version is called. Also, your frame rate could also not be helping meaning that your focus success rate is going to be lower than using a camera with an higher frame rate.

Also what focus points are you using, I normally use a single point, even using a small cluster can cause the focus to shift enough to ruin what you shooting.

I actually use a Tamron version of your lens, and I find that if I extend out to 600mm it can be soft on focus, so I extend out, then a slight twist back which for my lens has made a big difference, perhaps worth trying with your sigma lens.


The triod…

I don’t actually use a tripod, is try one at first, but well very bulky to carry, and often impractical to set up either in the hide, or an where you’ve found your spot to wait…

But I have just started to use a monopod, combined with a gimbal head, and was blown away with how much difference this has made with my IQ…. I do leave my VC on, as my thoughts are, I’m still holding the camera and moving it around….
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Yesterday I had the picture style set at standard, the pictures looked a bit dull so today I shot using landscape mode. I also use AF-C which should correspond to AI-Servo on Canon. Yes I also use single point, I tried some other modes like 9- and 21-point dynamic AF but I don't see why I should use them unless the bird stands out from the background like BIF. Don't like the idea of not using my lens at full focal length, I mean if I shoot a lot at 150-300mm there are many better lenses for that, I hope Sigma optimized the optics for 600mm. The tripod I'm using is a Benro with ball head, gimbals are too expensive at this point but I can imagine they are better for heavy lenses.
 
heron_AI said:
... I'm giving up half the focal length with my new equipment so I expect some improvement over P900 in terms of IQ.
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You'll get one, you've inadvertently been sucked into a falsehood. Your new camera has infinitely better IQ on the shots you've taken to test it.

And now you think I'm mad; but you said it...

heron_AI said:
It's an amazing camera and the stabilization is nothing short of magical. However, during winter months it really struggles with light and will on cloudy days refuse to acquire focus on dark subjects.
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You're comparing shots that you got which would have been impossible with your old kit, with shots that played to the strengths of that kit. Your new kit has beat the IQ of your old kit because those shots wouldn't have been captured.

As someone already said - photography is about light. A bright sun is a point light source that creates really sharply defined shadows, these shadows give an increased sense of 'contrast' which we often mistake for 'sharpness'.
 
I have this lens and it is heavy but I like to get the shutter speed up to around 1/2000. This u find works well and takes out my shake and subject movement.
 
I did some testing today with a test chart printed out on standard A4 dokument paper with a laser printer. I used two construction lights, 500W each on close distance to light up the test chart plus the little daylight I could get from outside. The pictures are therefore reddish in color, I have not edited the pictures except upping the exposure. All pictures use ISO 100 and shutter speed 1/1000, cameras are on tripod with stabilization off. Not enough light to use faster shutter speeds. All pictures were taken with 10s delay to allow camera and tripod to settle, took three pictures on each setting to rule out any focusing/shaking error. Distance between camera and chart appr. 6m/20ft. With the D5600 I used Live Mode and therefore Contrast Detection AF. I tested the P900 and the D5600 with the Sigma 150-600mm C with and without TC-1401 teleconverter. I'm not an expert and the test was done without professional tools and equipment so take it for what it is. The biggest surprise for me was how well the P900 performed at full zoom (2000mm, 35 eq.) Would like to hear your ideas. The comparison on the second last picture puts the D5600 + Sigma 150-600mm + TC-1401 combination ahead in every aspect, but keep in mind the P900 picture is more magnified (due to focal length/sensor size). On the last picture, the teleconverter may make the image a bit softer but it is more pleasing to look at, not sure how this difference translates to real-world subjects. I won't be scared to use the teleconverter for IQ issues anyway.

Nikon D5600, ISO100, 1/1000, F/6.3, 600mm, JPEG FINE


Nikon D5600, ISO100, 1/1000, F/8, 600mm, JPEG FINE


Nikon D5600, ISO100, 1/1000, F/6.3, 600mm, 12-bit RAW conv. to JPEG 100% quality in VievNX-i


Nikon D5600, ISO100, 1/1000, F/9, 850mm, JPEG FINE, TC-1401 1.4x


Nikon D5600, ISO100, 1/1000, F/9, 850mm, TC-1401 1.4x, 12-bit RAW conv. to JPEG 100% quality in VievNX-i


Nikon Coolpix P900, ISO100, 1/1000, F6.5, 357mm (2000mm, 35 eq.), JPEG FINE


100% crops, to the left, Nikon D5600 at 600mm + TC 1.4x, to the right Coolpix P900 357mm (Full zoom).


100% crops, to the left, Nikon D5600 at 600mm and to the right, same but with TC-1401
 
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heron_AI said:
I did some testing today with a test chart printed out on standard A4 dokument paper with a laser printer. I used two construction lights, 500W each on close distance to light up the test chart plus the little daylight I could get from outside. The pictures are therefore reddish in color, I have not edited the pictures except upping the exposure. All pictures use ISO 100 and shutter speed 1/1000, cameras are on tripod with stabilization off. Not enough light to use faster shutter speeds. All pictures were taken with 10s delay to allow camera and tripod to settle, took three pictures on each setting to rule out any focusing/shaking error. Distance between camera and chart appr. 6m/20ft. With the D5600 I used Live Mode and therefore Contrast Detection AF. I tested the P900 and the D5600 with the Sigma 150-600mm C with and without TC-1401 teleconverter. I'm not an expert and the test was done without professional tools and equipment so take it for what it is. The biggest surprise for me was how well the P900 performed at full zoom (2000mm, 35 eq.) Would like to hear your ideas. The comparison on the second last picture puts the D5600 + Sigma 150-600mm + TC-1401 combination ahead in every aspect, but keep in mind the P900 picture is more magnified (due to focal length/sensor size). On the last picture, the teleconverter may make the image a bit softer but it is more pleasing to look at, not sure how this difference translates to real-world subjects. I won't be scared to use the teleconverter for IQ issues anyway.

Nikon D5600, ISO100, 1/1000, F/6.3, 600mm, JPEG FINE


Nikon D5600, ISO100, 1/1000, F/8, 600mm, JPEG FINE


Nikon D5600, ISO100, 1/1000, F/6.3, 600mm, 12-bit RAW conv. to JPEG 100% quality in VievNX-i


Nikon D5600, ISO100, 1/1000, F/9, 850mm, JPEG FINE, TC-1401 1.4x


Nikon D5600, ISO100, 1/1000, F/9, 850mm, TC-1401 1.4x, 12-bit RAW conv. to JPEG 100% quality in VievNX-i


Nikon Coolpix P900, ISO100, 1/1000, F6.5, 357mm (2000mm, 35 eq.), JPEG FINE


100% crops, to the left, Nikon D5600 at 600mm + TC 1.4x, to the right Coolpix P900 357mm (Full zoom).


100% crops, to the left, Nikon D5600 at 600mm and to the right, same but with TC-1401
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Hard to tell, as clearly the exposures are different?

Also, if you're converting a raw file without processing it, it'll always look dull. The p900 shots have been processed in camera, the Nikon shots seem to be straight raw conversions?

TBH I'm not sure what you're trying to prove here, you might just be winding yourself up! Take it as read the Nikon with the Sigma is far more capable than the p900, it's just learning how to use it properly and to its strengths you need to concentrate on, rather than shooting test charts.
 
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How often do you shoot pictures of black-and-white paper lit by construction lights?

It seems to be your either looking for excuses, have "buyer's regret" or are pixel-peeping.

As many have said - we're in winter here, the light is poor, yet you're getting pretty good bird shots, which you wouldn't have gotten with the P900. Once the sun starts coming out and light is more abundant, your gear will really shine.
Your swan and goose shots were just under-exposed, so when lightened in PP, lose detail and clarity. Your tit was also ISO2200 which is pretty high for a bird in terms of feather detail - again, more light = lower ISO = better quality.

Stop pixel peeping and shooting test grids. The sun was out today with me! :D
 
Well it was raining and wanted to do a comparison with the P900. But now I can put this to rest, tomorrow I will go out and shoot birds again. Thank you all for the encouragement!
 
Heron I've not gone through all the posts so forgive me if I'm saying things that have already been said. Firstly I have to say I'm surprised by the images from the P900, they're better than I would have thought. Secondly, you will be able to get better pictures with your D5600 and sigma lens once you're used to it. Unfortunately when you start buying more 'specialist' gear the learning curve is harder and you don't tend to get it right first time. Spend some time getting to know the basics, getting to know your kit and you will see your images improve. I'd also suggest ditching the TC for now, looking at your test shots it degrades the image too much, for my tastes anyway. I'd rather crop in post to 'get in closer'. Also, as others have mentioned, light is your best friend. Some of your p900 shots are at ISO 100 yet your D5600 ones are at 2200, that's over 4 stops of light difference (assuming same shutter and aperture settings), you're going to notice a large difference in detail with that level of quality/quantity of light.

I would suggest trying your Sigma out in good light, reducing the focal length to 550mm (on the lens) and shooting at f8. The difference in framing between 550-600mm is negligible, and these lenses tend to be noticeably sharper at 550mm than 600mm, and at f8 it will be sharper too.
 
snerkler said:
Heron I've not gone through all the posts so forgive me if I'm saying things that have already been said. Firstly I have to say I'm surprised by the images from the P900, they're better than I would have thought. Secondly, you will be able to get better pictures with your D5600 and sigma lens once you're used to it. Unfortunately when you start buying more 'specialist' gear the learning curve is harder and you don't tend to get it right first time. Spend some time getting to know the basics, getting to know your kit and you will see your images improve. I'd also suggest ditching the TC for now, looking at your test shots it degrades the image too much, for my tastes anyway. I'd rather crop in post to 'get in closer'. Also, as others have mentioned, light is your best friend. Some of your p900 shots are at ISO 100 yet your D5600 ones are at 2200, that's over 4 stops of light difference (assuming same shutter and aperture settings), you're going to notice a large difference in detail with that level of quality/quantity of light.

I would suggest trying your Sigma out in good light, reducing the focal length to 550mm (on the lens) and shooting at f8. The difference in framing between 550-600mm is negligible, and these lenses tend to be noticeably sharper at 550mm than 600mm, and at f8 it will be sharper too.
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I went out today to a forest nearby and shot some birds, some of them on tripod, some hand-held and some with the support of a tree. I agree that keeping the camera still is more important than with the P900, virtually all blurry pictures I take with the D5600 is because of shaking, image quality is improved with a tripod. While I felt sure about my equipment yesterday and thought I could put this IQ issue behind me, today's shooting has made me doubt my gear again. Here's the thing, for me to carry around heavier equipment that costs almost four times more than my P900, I want a more noticable gain in IQ. Instead of using PSPX9 for converting my raw files, I used VievNX-i today and there's a big improvement. It was sunny today but the sun does not rise high over the horizon (about 19.4 degrees max.), so it's not as bright as in the summer. When I came home I sat down at a bench outside the balcony and put my camera on tripod, I had my telecoverter attached. I like the extra reach too much to give it up. (I'm used to having 2000mm.) I really focused on my technique and shot as steady as I could, my ISO setting was auto with max ISO set to 3200. Most images were taken with ISO3200, I can accept the noise level at 3200. I'm thinking of returning my Sigma for the Sports version, if it's that much sharper as shown on various reviewing sites it could be worth it, especially since I want to use a tc.
My camera doesn't struggle at all with AF, I can even use the outermost AF points.
See the MTF comparison between Contemparay and Sports: https://photographylife.com/reviews/sigma-150-600mm-f5-6-3-dg-os-hsm-c/3
Here are few pictures from today, all are at full zoom with TC 1.4x and F/10. The Treecreeper is hand-held, the rest on tripod. What do you all think?





 
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heron_AI said:
I went out today to a forest nearby and shot some birds, some of them on tripod, some hand-held and some with the support of a tree. I agree that keeping the camera still is more important than with the P900, virtually all blurry pictures I take with the D5600 is because of shaking, image quality is improved with a tripod. While I felt sure about my equipment yesterday and thought I could put this IQ issue behind me, today's shooting has made me doubt my gear again. Here's the thing, for me to carry around heavier equipment that costs almost four times more than my P900, I want a more noticable gain in IQ. Instead of using PSPX9 for converting my raw files, I used VievNX-i today and there's a big improvement. It was sunny today but the sun does not rise high over the horizon (about 19.4 degrees max.), so it's not as bright as in the summer. When I came home I sat down at a bench outside the balcony and put my camera on tripod, I had my telecoverter attached. I like the extra reach too much to give it up. (I'm used to having 2000mm.) I really focused on my technique and shot as steady as I could, my ISO setting was auto with max ISO set to 3200. Most images were taken with ISO3200, I can accept the noise level at 3200. I'm thinking of returning my Sigma for the Sports version, if it's that much sharper as shown on various reviewing sites it could be worth it, especially since I want to use a tc.
My camera doesn't struggle at all with AF, I can even use the outermost AF points.
See the MTF comparison between Contemparay and Sports: https://photographylife.com/reviews/sigma-150-600mm-f5-6-3-dg-os-hsm-c/3
Here are few pictures from today, all are at full zoom with TC 1.4x and F/10. The Treecreeper is hand-held, the rest on tripod. What do you all think?





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I can't see the images until I quote your post. However, I agree IQ isn't great with these. Before doing anything drastic I would ditch the TC and see what your images are like. Looking at your test shots the TC is really degrading them. The sport it only marginally better than the contemporary, maybe 5% better and I doubt it's going to make up for what's happening with these images. Of course, there's always a change it's a duff lens, but my money is a combination between TC and technique.

It is disappointing when you buy new gear and find you can't get the results of your old gear. We all know that, if everything working as expected the D5600 with Sigma will produce better images than your P900, but it takes time become good with a DSLR, especially when using heavy telephotos. NOt everyone will get to grips with it/have the patience to get to grips with it. But as I've said a couple of times, ditch the TC and see what your results are like.
 
snerkler said:
I can't see the images until I quote your post. However, I agree IQ isn't great with these. Before doing anything drastic I would ditch the TC and see what your images are like. Looking at your test shots the TC is really degrading them. The sport it only marginally better than the contemporary, maybe 5% better and I doubt it's going to make up for what's happening with these images. Of course, there's always a change it's a duff lens, but my money is a combination between TC and technique.

It is disappointing when you buy new gear and find you can't get the results of your old gear. We all know that, if everything working as expected the D5600 with Sigma will produce better images than your P900, but it takes time become good with a DSLR, especially when using heavy telephotos. NOt everyone will get to grips with it/have the patience to get to grips with it. But as I've said a couple of times, ditch the TC and see what your results are like.
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Only 5% better, you sure about that?
Well, here are three images without TC at 600mm, not better. The last picture of a Swan I took two weeks ago with my old P900, with slightly less sunlight than today and at full zoom (no editing). Should I really be happy with the images I get with my new gear? If it takes years of practice to get a decent picture with a DSLR, then no wonder the market is shrinking...







 
heron_AI said:
Only 5% better, you sure about that?
Well, here are three images without TC at 600mm, not better. The last picture of a Swan I took two weeks ago with my old P900, with slightly less sunlight than today and at full zoom (no editing). Should I really be happy with the images I get with my new gear? If it takes years of practice to get a decent picture with a DSLR, then no wonder the market is shrinking...







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These are failing in the basic principles of photography, they're simply under exposed.

That's not the fault of the kit, the Nikon and Sigma are more than capable of getting these shots.

I can't see here, what settings are you using? (Particularly ISO, aperture and what metering mode are you using?)

By the way, optically the Sport was no better than the C when I tested both, on crop and FF.

As I said in my last post, it's not the kit, it's infinitely more capable than the p900. If you look at the thread for the 150-600c you'll see what it's capable of, which you're just not getting.
 
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As been mentioned the camera and lens are excellent but the light isn't helping us this time of year. Here are a couple of photos taken with the Sigma 150-600mm Contemporary through my kitchen door double glazing. You can see the fine feather detail on the birds. So I would say its a matter of gaining experience using the combo. I wouldn't bother with the Sport version as you will see little gain.

If your going out perhaps a Monopod would be better rather than lugging a tripod around?

Coal Tit. by Swansea Jack, on Flickr

Goldfinch Portrait by Swansea Jack, on Flickr
 
odd jim said:
These are failing in the basic principles of photography, they're simply under exposed.

That's not the fault of the kit, the Nikon and Sigma are more than capable of getting these shots.

I can't see here, what settings are you using? (Particularly ISO, aperture and what metering mode are you using?)

By the way, optically the Sport was no better than the C when I tested both, on crop and FF.

As I said in my last post, it's not the kit, it's infinitely more capable than the p900. If you look at the thread for the 150-600c you'll see what it's capable of, which you're just not getting.
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Hmm.. it's interesting that real world photos (other than test charts) seem to show very little, if any, difference between the C and the S, then what are those lab tests good for anyway?

The first picture: 1/1000, ISO 560, F/6.3
The second picture: 1/1000, ISO 2200, F/6.3
The third picture: 1/1000, ISO 1100, F/6.3
All three, +1/3 ev, I think it was matrix metering

Your pictures are really good!
 
Swanseajack said:
As been mentioned the camera and lens are excellent but the light isn't helping us this time of year. Here are a couple of photos taken with the Sigma 150-600mm Contemporary through my kitchen door double glazing. You can see the fine feather detail on the birds. So I would say its a matter of gaining experience using the combo. I wouldn't bother with the Sport version as you will see little gain.

If your going out perhaps a Monopod would be better rather than lugging a tripod around?

Coal Tit. by Swansea Jack, on Flickr

Goldfinch Portrait by Swansea Jack, on Flickr
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That Goldfinch looks amazing! That's the IQ I want.
I prefer tripod, however, it's convertible to a monopod if I need one. What is the highet ISO you would typically use? On my P900, I rarely used any pictures with ISO over 200, too much noise! 3200 seems acceptable on D5600.
 
heron_AI said:
Hmm.. it's interesting that real world photos (other than test charts) seem to show very little, if any, difference between the C and the S, then what are those lab tests good for anyway?

The first picture: 1/1000, ISO 560, F/6.3
The second picture: 1/1000, ISO 2200, F/6.3
The third picture: 1/1000, ISO 1100, F/6.3
All three, +1/3 ev, I think it was matrix metering

Your pictures are really good!
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Thanks :)

I think you could lower the shutter speed significantly and let more light in, I don't think for the subject 1/1000 is really needed?
 
heron_AI said:
Only 5% better, you sure about that?
Well, here are three images without TC at 600mm, not better. The last picture of a Swan I took two weeks ago with my old P900, with slightly less sunlight than today and at full zoom (no editing). Should I really be happy with the images I get with my new gear? If it takes years of practice to get a decent picture with a DSLR, then no wonder the market is shrinking...
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As others have already said (and demonstrated with sample shots), the camera & lens is capable of superb results, but there is a bit of learning to get the best out of it.

The first image there's not a lot to say, as the post doesn't have much detail to it to show off the capabilities of your gear.
The second image has the bird in partial shadow, you're shooting wide open at max zoom - all things that will make life a bit harder for yourself.

To help learn the capabilities of the gear, and gain a bit more confidence in it, try practising on a well lit (static) subject - wind the zoom in a little (try 500-550 as Snerkler suggested), close the aperture a touch to f/8 (as Snerkler suggested) and try to fill the frame more with your subject.

If you're using a tripod remember to turn off IS

See how it goes, and if all is well try pushing the limits a little, but one by one (try a shot with a bit longer zoom, another with a wider aperture, if both are OK try a longer zoom and wider aperture, etc).
 
Swanseajack said:
As been mentioned the camera and lens are excellent but the light isn't helping us this time of year. Here are a couple of photos taken with the Sigma 150-600mm Contemporary through my kitchen door double glazing. You can see the fine feather detail on the birds. So I would say its a matter of gaining experience using the combo. I wouldn't bother with the Sport version as you will see little gain.

If your going out perhaps a Monopod would be better rather than lugging a tripod around?

Coal Tit. by Swansea Jack, on Flickr

Goldfinch Portrait by Swansea Jack, on Flickr
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Great detail on the goldfinch, how close were you? I assume that's quite a crop?
 
odd jim said:
Thanks :)

I think you could lower the shutter speed significantly and let more light in, I don't think for the subject 1/1000 is really needed?
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LOL, I know, it's because I chose to have ISO set to auto, max 3200 and I had my camera in AP. I wanted to make camera shake factor in as little as possible while testing.
 
heron_AI said:
LOL, I know, it's because I chose to have ISO set to auto, max 3200 and I had my camera in AP. I wanted to make camera shake factor in as little as possible while testing.
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Try using aperture priority, wide open (the Sigma is very good wide open) and adjust the ISO so you're getting between 1/100 and 1/400 (that way you're shutter speed is suitable and you're not using a higher ISO than is needed). Also try using spot metering. And as always, shoot with a properly lit subject as with any subject :)
 
Faldrax said:
As others have already said (and demonstrated with sample shots), the camera & lens is capable of superb results, but there is a bit of learning to get the best out of it.

The first image there's not a lot to say, as the post doesn't have much detail to it to show off the capabilities of your gear.
The second image has the bird in partial shadow, you're shooting wide open at max zoom - all things that will make life a bit harder for yourself.

To help learn the capabilities of the gear, and gain a bit more confidence in it, try practising on a well lit (static) subject - wind the zoom in a little (try 500-550 as Snerkler suggested), close the aperture a touch to f/8 (as Snerkler suggested) and try to fill the frame more with your subject.

If you're using a tripod remember to turn off IS

See how it goes, and if all is well try pushing the limits a little, but one by one (try a shot with a bit longer zoom, another with a wider aperture, if both are OK try a longer zoom and wider aperture, etc).
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Ok, I only have a ten days window to return the lens to the seller, so I want to be sure I'm happy with it before that time runs out. I have the IS on while on tripod, will turn it off next time. Thanks for the input.
 
@heron_AI - i recognize some of your frustration as i was also initially disappointed with sharpness from a new long lens. I expect most of the points that helped me are covered, but in case not:

0. Have enough light. If there's no exposure possible that has a chance of a sharp shot with acceptable noise then I no longer setup or press the shutter

1. Shutter shake. This was the biggest issue for me, trying to minimize ISO by slowing shutter too much. The solutions I found were - keep the shutter speed high for handheld shots, maybe double the 1 / focal length rule.
- Take lots of shots, seems to a random element so more shots is good insurance against fuzzy shots
- otherwise mount on stable tripod
- for static objects can also use remote release or shutter delay to reduce chance of camera shake due to pressing the shutter. With this approach I've got sharp shots at low ISO with really slow shutter speeds

2. Micro adjust AF. Only a small adjust turned out to be needed. The points in 1 solved most of the disappointment.

Good luck.
 
heron_AI said:
Only 5% better, you sure about that?
Well, here are three images without TC at 600mm, not better. The last picture of a Swan I took two weeks ago with my old P900, with slightly less sunlight than today and at full zoom (no editing). Should I really be happy with the images I get with my new gear? If it takes years of practice to get a decent picture with a DSLR, then no wonder the market is shrinking...
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The DSLR market is not shrinking because of this, it's most likely due to the advancements of phone cams and everybody wanting instagram type photos. Using a DSLR is arguably easier now than it's ever been with the sophisticated AF systems, metering systems etc etc. It doesn't take years of practice to get a "decent" picture, but you sure can't give up after 2 tries with the camera. Of course, it might just not be for you and you may be happier sticking to what you have (y).
 
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