It's taken me years of dedication and hard work to get this shoddy at shooting film...
One of the main reasons I got a LF camera was to shoot big slides, I've never quite got the nerve up for it...
Ok, I admit it I'm a fraud! She's got another roll of film in the Lomo sampler camera you sent to her :0)
Until you wrote that, @StephenM , I though @Carl Hall 's logic was impeccable, and I'm finding your explanation hard to understand. He's using a grad filter to bring down the sky, that would otherwise be over-exposed. Then he's choosing an exposure that allows for the foreground (comparatively shadow) to be 2 stops less and the sky (highlight) to be 2 stops more, giving him a 4-stop range, roughly on target for slide film. I'm guessing there is something I'm missing here?
A neutral density grad has no effect on the exposure at all, because it's intended to darken the area it's covering, and adjusting the exposure because of its presence nullifies that presence.
We'll just wait to see if @Carl Hall can stuff a box of sheet film before we even attempt it,.........then I'll let you go first steveo
That sounds like the way I do it Carl except I take my phone out of my pocket, open the light meter app and point it generally at the scene. I then use the settings given to expose the slide. Some people call me slapdash but I'm not sure where they get that from ;0)
It's pretty much known by everyone ( in f&c anyway) to expose for the shadows with (negative) film and expose for the highlights if shooting digital.
One of the main reasons I got a LF camera was to shoot big slides, I've never quite got the nerve up for it...
Slide film has two big differences compared to negative film: you have no chance to recover blown highlights, and there is a smaller subject brightness range that you can record.
Generally speaking, people prefer blocked shadows to blank, clear film being projected, so the conventional wisdom is to expose for the highlights, just like digital. What isn't just like digital is that there is no raw file, and no means of clawing back. If it's gone, it's gone. Film latitude is directly related to the subject brightness range that it can record, so you have much less latitude with slides.
In your specific case, if the foreground is correctly exposed at 1/4 @ f/32, then that's the exposure to go for. A neutral density grad has no effect on the exposure at all, because it's intended to darken the area it's covering, and adjusting the exposure because of its presence nullifies that presence.
To ensure that the highlights are correctly exposed, an incident light meter is usually recommended; failing that, meter from a grey card or the palm of your hand and adjust as required. Both are effectively measuing an artificial highlight, just as an incident meter does.
I read the post as the correct exposure for the foreground was the exposure required for the main subject, and the sky (from the reading) would be blown out. If that's the correct reading, then I stand by my post. If the foreground is in shadow, and therefore should be rendered darker, then you're correct in knocking off a couple of stops. But in that case I'd take exception to Carl's statement that the exposure was 1/4 etc.
Does it help if I amplify? The whole point of a graduated filter is to make a specific area darker. The rest of the scene should be unaffected, and receive the same exposure, hence the filter factor should be zero. If you're using a TTL meter, then this will very likely take account of the darkening of the grad, and give more exposure, thus partially negating the effect of the filter, and also overexposing the rest of the scene by whatever adjustment it made.
In metering the highlights and choosing the appropriate strength if grad, you should have knocked the subject brightness range back to one that the film can handle, and the highlight reading becomes irrelevant.
If you photograph a scene which has a (shadowy) foreground which meters 1 sec at f/32, and a dim sky which meters 1/15 at f/32 (so 4 stops brighter), would you then set the exposure at 1/4 sec? the shadows will be dark and the highlights bright, but all the detail is captured? If so, then would adding an ND grad filter to darken the sky, and bring the original 6 stop range down to 4 stops, not be correct?
Your scenario is not quite as precise to my mind as it is to yours. The foreground is shadowy, but what does that actually mean? If pointing the meter directly at it indicates an exposure of 1 second, then that exposure will give you a mid grey (or whatever colour it is, since we're presumably talking about colour slide film). To darken it, give less exposure. But how much less? That depends on how shadowy it was. Knock off a couple of stops and make it shaded; knock off more and reduce it to shadows you can just about see in to. How much you knock off depends on your correctly identifying which zone you want to place it on.
A dim sky? How dim is dim? If you've metered that directly, then the 1/15 will give a mid grey, and 1/2 will make it a nice white, bright sky. And make the foreground brighter too. How grey do you want the sky to be? That's the same question again as the shadows.
Perhaps I'm overly simplifying things because I don't use slide film and I've never needed to use a grad filter.
Pleeeease tell me that's right now!
It sounds right to me
It sounds right to me
@Andysnap I remember someone having a swanky fresnel lens on their 4x5 camera at the Peaks Meet... Was it by any chance your good self? My memory is pretty crap sometimes
My Ebony has one, you were having a play with that also. I do recall Andy mentioning something about Fresnel lenses though...
Yep, I had a fresnel screen. One of the ones that @stevelmx5 recommended, very cheap if I remeber rightly and it does seem to work. It just sits on top of the ground glass.
It's cut out of the centre of one of these;
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201649314172
I used one on my Polaroid 110 and it made a massive difference in the brightness. If you use a loupe it might not be great because you will see the edges of the circles but for normal viewing it was fine.
Doh!No problem mate. Just remember to cut it out of the centre of the plastic fresnel sheet rather than one corner then realise that the circles aren't really helping...don't ask how I know ;0)
At the risk of angering the CMS, I have rashly spent £35 on an old Thornton Pickard branded Beck Symmetrical, this one
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Antique-THORNTON-PICKARD-BECK-SYMMETRICAL-PLATE-CAMERA-LENS-APERTURE-F-8-64-/351858397726?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&nma=true&si=4Q6vaLT2QiOG0L9I1O4Wnv01e5I%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc
Now, I don't know the focal length or even if it covers 4x5 (although I suspect it will) but I really fancy shooting some portraits with it so, how do I do that given that it doesn't have a shutter? Can I buy a shutter? Do I need to buy a top hat? Basically... HELP!!!!!
Set up in the front room. Turn off the lights or blackout the room. Remove lens cap and fire a flash gun. Replace lens cap. Switch on lights.