New Toys - Godox AD600 has arrived

Well a progress report, first function shot with the AD600 which was used as the main light, AD360II as fill and then 2xV860 with X!-Rs for triggers and all controlled from the X1T-N

worked a treat, unfortunately due to the nature of the event there are no images to share, I can see another AD600 in the kit bag soon

Mike
 
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Given that the ad600 appears only slightly more powerful than ad360ii what are advantages does it have?
 
si019 said:
Given that the ad600 appears only slightly more powerful than ad360ii what are advantages does it have?
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When used with the same modifier it has approx 1 stop more power and importantly 600W is the usual power quoted to overpower sunlight. It is a very different beast, things such as built in modelling light, all in one as opposed to pack and head system, takes Bowens mount modifiers directly, faster recycling - for me it is what the AD360 would be if designed for the studio but can also be used outdoors.- I have both and they suit different roles

MIke
 
Conceptually at least, the Godox AD600 looks like my idea of how a professional system of the future should be, for both studio and location work. Plus speedlites using the same radio control system - that would then have every job covered, in the most efficient, versatile and affordable package yet.

- All-in-one battery powered
- AC mains option
- Small/light
- Separate head/pack option
- Plenty of power over a wide range,1200Ws option
- Fast flash durations
- Bright modelling lamp (doubtful here...)
- Fast recycling (needs to be 1.5secs or better)
- HSS, second-curtain sync
- Auto-TTL radio control
- Standard S-fit mount
- Good value

This seems like a pretty obvious wants list, and so much better than having separate outfits for studio and location work, plus a bunch of speedlites too, all using different control systems. We already have the technology. Godox has made a great start, Phottix and others are moving in the same direction (Yongnuo has shown prototypes). Come to think of it, with the 'strategic alliance' that Phottix has with Elinchrom now, they could get together and produce a killer total system :)
 
HoppyUK said:
This seems like a pretty obvious wants list, and so much better than having separate outfits for studio and location work, plus a bunch of speedlites too, all using different control systems. We already have the technology. Godox has made a great start, Phottix and others are moving in the same direction (Yongnuo has shown prototypes). Come to think of it, with the 'strategic alliance' that Phottix has with Elinchrom now, they could get together and produce a killer total system :)
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The only isue is that Einchrom are saying that IGBT / HSS is not the way to go and the weakness was their trigger system but now they ae using Phottix they have moved forward.

Mike
 
mike weeks said:
The only isue is that Einchrom are saying that IGBT / HSS is not the way to go and the weakness was their trigger system but now they ae using Phottix they have moved forward.

Mike
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Elinchrom has no IGBT expertise, so they would say that ;) If they want IGBT technology, they need to buy it in, or take a short-cut. IGBT is not a complete solution, with a major weakness being fast durations that are only available at lower power settings, but right now, on balance I think IGBT is better overall - mainly because of high-speed sync capability.

On the other hand, the tables may turn when we get global electronic shutters, ie the whole sensor switches on/off according to shutter speed, with no rolling shutter. That will bring an end to the curse of x-sync limitations and HSS won't be needed. It's the Holy Grail for camera manufacturers - a solid-state camera - and it will happen, maybe quite soon. Panasonic and Fuji announced a breakthrough just a few days ago http://www.dpreview.com/news/656227...ilm-reveal-joint-sensor-offers-global-shutter
 
HoppyUK said:
Elinchrom has no IGBT expertise, so they would say that ;)
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You old cynic, but that makes two of us

It's the Holy Grail for camera manufacturers - a solid-state camera - and it will happen, maybe quite soon. Panasonic and Fuji announced a breakthrough just a few days ago http://www.dpreview.com/news/656227...ilm-reveal-joint-sensor-offers-global-shutter
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Yes, I keep up to date with such things myself. It will be a game changer if it happens and of course the same technology could be migrated to meters so we could meter at any speed

Mike
 
For the people that now have the AD600 what kind of bag do you use to carry it round in? I'm currently using a Tamrac Pro12 which fits the AD600 with the standard reflector fitted but it's not a snug fit so it rattles around in there. I was just wondering if anyone had anything that was a bit more tailor made for a light like this.

All my camera gear and speedlights fit in my Lowepro X200 so I'm looking for a bag specifically for the AD600.
 
mike weeks said:
New toys - in the words of Crocodile Dundee- "that's not a flashgun, this is a flashgun"
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What is the difference between the AD600 and RS600? They seem very similar and the RS600 already is separated from the battery without an adapter. Is there any major benefit of one over the other?

I don't think I would ever use TTL on the 600 model so unsure which to go for.
 
Ballyman said:
What is the difference between the AD600 and RS600? They seem very similar and the RS600 already is separated from the battery without an adapter. Is there any major benefit of one over the other?

I don't think I would ever use TTL on the 600 model so unsure which to go for.
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Vast vast difference, as the AD600 goes down in power the flash duration decreases whereas the RS600 increases
X1 tigger means that all new Godox devices play happily
Yes it has TTL but a much cheaper NON TTL version of the AD600 is available (when you need TTL it is great to know it is there)
AD600 has a remote head option so in essence can be used just like the RS600 with separate battery,
Digital display on AD600 provides lots of good info and firmware updates mean things like the one head can be used by Nikon, Sony or Canon - can be used as wireless master or slave, so many things in that area of control that are not available on the RS600

Mike
 
I had another look and it seems the RS model doesn't support HSS either so thats my mind pretty much made up - the AD600 it is.
I have 3 Elinchrom D Lite 4's, 1 Elinchrom D Lite 2, 2 Canon 580Ex2's and two sets of PIxel Kings that are all going to be gotten rid of to make way for this. I should have a couple of hundred € left over too hopefully.
Glad I found this thread as I was only minutes away from buying the Pixel Pros and X800C's!!! Thanks for your help.
 
Ballyman said:
I had another look and it seems the RS model doesn't support HSS either so thats my mind pretty much made up - the AD600 it is.
I have 3 Elinchrom D Lite 4's, 1 Elinchrom D Lite 2, 2 Canon 580Ex2's and two sets of PIxel Kings that are all going to be gotten rid of to make way for this. I should have a couple of hundred € left over too hopefully.
Glad I found this thread as I was only minutes away from buying the Pixel Pros and X800C's!!! Thanks for your help.
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For studio work, you might want to check the brightness of the AD600 modelling LED before parting with the D-Lites. With all the battery/portable systems I've tested, they vary from just about okay to quite useless. Not tried the AD600 though; be interesting to know what Mike W thinks.
 
HoppyUK said:
For studio work, you might want to check the brightness of the AD600 modelling LED before parting with the D-Lites. With all the battery/portable systems I've tested, they vary from just about okay to quite useless. Not tried the AD600 though; be interesting to know what Mike W thinks.
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Lets say that it is enough light to aid focussing but would struggle as a modelling light

Mike
 
Phil V said:
I'm waiting for the price to stabilise, although I did see an interesting price advertised today, but no stock. :(
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I got a very good deal on the Pixapro branded one from Essential Photo (with full proper UK warranty) at the Photography show. So good it wasn't worth buying a Godox branded one from a dodgy ebay seller. I've not used it in anger yet, just had a play the other evening but all looks good!
 
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GerryS said:
I got a very good deal on the Pixapro branded one from Essential Photo (with full proper UK warranty) at the Photography show. So good it wasn't worth buying a Godox branded one from a dodgy ebay seller. I've not used it in anger yet, just had a play the other evening but all looks good!
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Firstly Godox is the OEM, any other name would be secondary branded and why do you say that ebay sellers are dodgy? Many places that this can be bought and knowing the owner at Pixapro I am sure you will get looked after should issues arise,

Mike
 
mike weeks said:
Firstly Godox is the OEM, any other name would be secondary branded and why do you say that ebay sellers are dodgy? Many places that this can be bought and knowing the owner at Pixapro I am sure you will get looked after should issues arise,

Mike
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Yes I know Godox is the manufacturer. I bought from Essential Photo because they are a real company, in England with stock and a real, proper warranty. I have in the past bought stuff from China based dodgy eBay sellers and tried to get replacements when stuff didn't work on arrival. It doesn't happen, lesson learned although I accept there maybe some eBay sellers that aren't dodgy. Personally I'd rather pay a slight premium and buy from someone such as Essential Photo for peace of mind.
 
Ballyman said:
I had another look and it seems the RS model doesn't support HSS either so thats my mind pretty much made up - the AD600 it is.
I have 3 Elinchrom D Lite 4's, 1 Elinchrom D Lite 2, 2 Canon 580Ex2's and two sets of PIxel Kings that are all going to be gotten rid of to make way for this. I should have a couple of hundred € left over too hopefully.
Glad I found this thread as I was only minutes away from buying the Pixel Pros and X800C's!!! Thanks for your help.
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Short answer - if you want a flash system for studio use, then get a studio flash. Much cheaper, smaller and lighter, much less that can go wrong with it and much faster recycling at normal power settings too, plus of course the modelling lamp issue. Likewise, if you want a portable flash system, then get one. What you're proposing to get is really a crossover that can do both, but can do neither as well as a dedicated unit.
Personally, I don't see any point in either HSS it TTL for studio use, but if TTL does matter to you, be aware that there are two different models, the TTL one is a lot more expensive.
GerryS said:
Yes I know Godox is the manufacturer. I bought from Essential Photo because they are a real company, in England with stock and a real, proper warranty. I have in the past bought stuff from China based dodgy eBay sellers and tried to get replacements when stuff didn't work on arrival. It doesn't happen, lesson learned although I accept there maybe some eBay sellers that aren't dodgy. Personally I'd rather pay a slight premium and buy from someone such as Essential Photo for peace of mind.
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I totally agree that you'll be up the creek without a paddle when things go wrong with Ebay sellers. Basically buying complex electronic equipment via Ebay is a bit like self-insurance, which is fine if you can afford to carry the risk yourself. But have you actually read the terms of the warranty?
 
Well this is a bit unexpected, I knew that there was going to be a 1200W head that meant you would have to combine 2 AD600s but the news is there may also be a 2400W head on the way that combines 4 heads, I can see the public reporting small nuclear explosions with them http://www.lightingrumours.com/godox-remote-heads-8163

Mike
 
mike weeks said:
Well this is a bit unexpected, I knew that there was going to be a 1200W head that meant you would have to combine 2 AD600s but the news is there may also be a 2400W head on the way that combines 4 heads, I can see the public reporting small nuclear explosions with them http://www.lightingrumours.com/godox-remote-heads-8163

Mike
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Godox seem to have got their head around outdoor flash :) In bright daylight with large modifiers, you can't have too much power and while 2400Ws sounds like a bomb, it's only two stops brighter than 600Ws. I can see this being really liberating for some users that live in constant fear of the weather misbehaving on the day, and a very nice-to-have option for anyone looking to invest in a new system.

I did some equestrian photography recently, for a friend. Luckily it was overcast, but I worked out that to do what I really wanted on a sunny day (ie over-powering daylight with a decent softbox) would need at least 2400Ws, and preferably two of those :eek:
 
HoppyUK said:
Godox seem to have got their head around outdoor flash :) In bright daylight with large modifiers, you can't have too much power and while 2400Ws sounds like a bomb, it's only two stops brighter than 600Ws. I can see this being really liberating for some users that live in constant fear of the weather misbehaving on the day, and a very nice-to-have option for anyone looking to invest in a new system.

I did some equestrian photography recently, for a friend. Luckily it was overcast, but I worked out that to do what I really wanted on a sunny day (ie over-powering daylight with a decent softbox) would need at least 2400Ws, and preferably two of those :eek:
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What is of interest to me is that you can buy 4 of the manual versions on EBay for about £1500, looking at the lead it will be about £100 and the bulb hopefully in the same ballpark so another £100 i.e. £1700 will get you a genuine 2400W power in a single head, whilst recharge may not be very close to Broncolor neither is the price and for the occasional user this may be something special.

Mike
 
Mixed feelings about whether this system is terribly practical myself. Take for example if you needed it to light something large, like a building interior, or a car, which seem to be things that are likely applications for a 2400 head. You would need at least 2 such heads and probably more in fact. If I needed to put 4 such light sources round a car, 4x4 = 16 heads to power 4 flash tubes. That is one hell of a lot of gear to do something which could be done by individual packs. And when you start to compare it to the price of second hand pack systems, to me it seems like a very over complicated method of doing things.
 
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PPPPP said:
Mixed feelings about whether this system is terribly practical myself. Take for example if you needed it to light something large, like a building interior, or a car, which seem to be things that are likely applications for a 2400 head. You would need at least 2 such heads and probably more in fact. If I needed to put 4 such light sources round a car, 4x4 = 16 heads to power 4 flash tubes. That is one hell of a lot of gear to do something which could be done by individual packs. And when you start to compare it to the price of second hand pack systems, to me it seems like a very over complicated method of doing things.
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Perhaps you missed the bit where I said occasional user. If you really have to light that sort of thing you either have a large equipped studio or you hire in as required. The big difference is price, if I exchanged all my mains heads for these I could have a 4 & 2 setup i.e. 2400W & 1200W, now replace current battery lights as well and suddenly I am in that range, reality is that I very rarely have to light with more than 4 heads but there is some equestrian work where more than 600W would be beneficial and I have no need of large packs, so not a solution for all but for those that need it.

Mike
 
juggler said:
Anyone done/come across any flash duration measurements for these?

I know direct comparisons are rather difficult but it'd be interesting to know how they compared to, say, the Lencarta Superfasts at a given level of light output.
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You just set the light and it tells you the duration and importantly it is the t0.1 time not the t.5 as used by the likes of Profoto

Mike
 
full power t0.1 is 1/220 and 1/256 power is 1/10,000
1/2 power 1/740
1/4 power 1/1470
1/8 power 1/2352

Profoto B1 is 1/1000 at full power (500W) but that is t0.5 so more like 1/330 at t0.1

even in flash duration mode it is 1/19,000 at minimum power (2W) which again would be about 1/6500 for t0.1

Superfast full power 1/800th at t0.1 so more stopping power
at lowest power it is quoted as 1/20000

So the Godox AD600 to my mind matches up well to the B1 in terms of flash duration but the Superfast is best if you want freezing power between those but I am going to throw something else into the mix

The Safari 2 at full power quotes 1/1500 for t0.1 where there is a major difference is that as you turn the power down the duration increase to 1/600 at minimum, so if you need battery and are going to work at max power then the Safari 2 or as I have the RS600P is an interesting choice. I had to work this out for doing a shoot and ended up using the RS600P

Mike
 
mike weeks said:
full power t0.1 is 1/220 and 1/256 power is 1/10,000
1/2 power 1/740
1/4 power 1/1470
1/8 power 1/2352

Profoto B1 is 1/1000 at full power (500W) but that is t0.5 so more like 1/330 at t0.1

even in flash duration mode it is 1/19,000 at minimum power (2W) which again would be about 1/6500 for t0.1

Superfast full power 1/800th at t0.1 so more stopping power
at lowest power it is quoted as 1/20000

So the Godox AD600 to my mind matches up well to the B1 in terms of flash duration but the Superfast is best if you want freezing power between those but I am going to throw something else into the mix

The Safari 2 at full power quotes 1/1500 for t0.1 where there is a major difference is that as you turn the power down the duration increase to 1/600 at minimum, so if you need battery and are going to work at max power then the Safari 2 or as I have the RS600P is an interesting choice. I had to work this out for doing a shoot and ended up using the RS600P

Mike
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Thank you, that's all very useful.
 
PPPPP said:
Mixed feelings about whether this system is terribly practical myself. Take for example if you needed it to light something large, like a building interior, or a car, which seem to be things that are likely applications for a 2400 head. You would need at least 2 such heads and probably more in fact. If I needed to put 4 such light sources round a car, 4x4 = 16 heads to power 4 flash tubes. That is one hell of a lot of gear to do something which could be done by individual packs. And when you start to compare it to the price of second hand pack systems, to me it seems like a very over complicated method of doing things.
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I agree. If you need that amount of power then the solution is to get pro equipment designed for the purpose, there's plenty of it around second hand, and due to the very low level of demand for it, it's very cheap. I used to have an Elinchrom power pack that produced 6,000Ws from either 1 or 2 heads, and getting something like that, guaranteed to work well, and an inverter to power it, is the obvious solution when very high levels of power are needed .
juggler said:
Anyone done/come across any flash duration measurements for these?

I know direct comparisons are rather difficult but it'd be interesting to know how they compared to, say, the Lencarta Superfasts at a given level of light output.
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We were using the SuperFasts in our studio yesterday to freeze really fast action, and I don't think that anything else comes close to them in either performance or price. I can't show the photos yet, all I can say is that they were shot at 10fps and every burst of shots produced more than one choice of image.
These were shots of some very athletic people from various army regiments including a regiment that we're not allowed to mention.
All I can show you at the moment is this picture of the flag that they hoisted at the entrance to "Lencarta Towers" :)flag_red.jpg
 
Garry and PPPPP, that's not how I'm looking at Godox. I'm thinking of a total flash system, that runs from speedlites, through studio, and on to outdoors location. Previously, that required three* separate outfits, all using incompatible sync/remotes, and quite likely different modifier mounts too, at very substantial cost.

With something like the Godox (Phottix is similar in principle) I might get say two speedlites and four AD600 heads and there wouldn't be much it couldn't tackle - tremendous versatility, big power, fast flash durations, HSS, auto-TTL, and all using the same sync/remote control. Another thing is there's a fair amount of breakdown cover if something falls over or goes pop, there's a very good chance of working around it.

It's early days for this kind of kit, and I haven't yet used the Godox AD600. From what I know though, the only thing that appears to be missing is, I think, decent modelling lamps for studio working. AFAIK, only Elinchrom and Profoto have adressed that properly with battery power, and they're not that good, but at least workable.

*Maybe four separate outfits, if you want both big location battery packs and a shoulder-portable system.
 
HoppyUK said:
Garry and PPPPP, that's not how I'm looking at Godox. I'm thinking of a total flash system, that runs from speedlites, through studio, and on to outdoors location. Previously, that required three* separate outfits, all using incompatible sync/remotes, and quite likely different modifier mounts too, at very substantial cost.

With something like the Godox (Phottix is similar in principle) I might get say two speedlites and four AD600 heads and there wouldn't be much it couldn't tackle - tremendous versatility, big power, fast flash durations, HSS, auto-TTL, and all using the same sync/remote control. Another thing is there's a fair amount of breakdown cover if something falls over or goes pop, there's a very good chance of working around it.

It's early days for this kind of kit, and I haven't yet used the Godox AD600. From what I know though, the only thing that appears to be missing is, I think, decent modelling lamps for studio working. AFAIK, only Elinchrom and Profoto have adressed that properly with battery power, and they're not that good, but at least workable.

*Maybe four separate outfits, if you want both big location battery packs and a shoulder-portable system.
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@HoppyUK that is exactly how I am thinking, at present I have 4 trigger systems and backups within those, I will just need 1, I do not need modelling light, just focusing, AD600 provides what I need and the fact that a Sony or cannon user only needs the X1 version for their system means I will carry a couple more spare triggers but know I have multiple options open to me - as an event photographer this system approach is unparalleled, a couple of V860IIs, a couple of AD360IIs and a couple of AD600s means I can tackle nearly all my work. I can also use all my old kit using XTR 16s or X1Rs from a manual AD360 to an RS600P or an SB800

Mike
 
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