Nikon mirrorless definitely on the way

Raymond Lin said:
It might be a lot faster if they just do a Sigma :p
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And also might not win many hearts by doing that :p

Though canon can basically do this by default since EF-M and EF basically use the same protocols. It's just dumb wire connectors in the adapter.
 
Cagey75 said:
So am I. Well, you say friends, some of them I can't stand but I know enough of them. You don't have to tell me about the weather lol, I live in it, in winter it's dank, miserable, wet and with many wedding meals not finished until 6pm or thereabouts, and often p***ing rain on the day, you can bet your ass photographers are using lighting for group shots. Next one I'm at I'll be sure to get a picture of them doing just that. I know i'd be delighted if I shot a wedding and didn't feel the need to use a speedlight, be great! it wouldn't be some of the places I've been for weddings. But like Phil suggested, get it done earlier when the light is good, and that is all i will remember from this side-tracking. Seriously, all because an F4 lens was mentioned and i suggested using flash :rolleyes: You wedding togs are way too sensitive about your craft, you're even arguing the blimmin' weather now :LOL: It's still August and I had to re-wash a pile of clothes because they got drenched overnight from showers.

Are you considering a Z for your wedding photography?
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The weather must be very different in the republic. I work in Northern Ireland and while we do occasionally use ocf for portraits with the bride and groom late on, we wouldn't use it for group photos. Since the turn of the year we have shot just under 30 weddings and haven't needed to use ocf flash at any of them. Although we have used ocf for some stuff but that was down to personal choice for a few shots of the bride and groom rather than group photos. Most wedding venues will have an area that is well lit enough to use when the weather is particularly bad but it's very rare that at some point during the day there won't be 10 minutes or so to knock out a few group photographs where it isn't p***ing it down. Although maybe our weather is just better than yours but I doubt it.

I also know quite a few local wedding photographers both here and in the republic and of those only one uses ocf a lot and he is quite an old school traditional guy. There are very few of those around any more. A lot of the old school guys do shoot everything with on camera flash but the on board flash and shoot everything at f/8 brigade are dying out fast.

I don't believe it has ever been the case that a large amount of wedding guys used ocf regularly especially not for group photos.

Raymond Lin said:
Just for your information because you keep mentioning 6pm after food.

I have never ever shot or been to a wedding where the photos happens AFTER the food so it’s never 6pm, especially in the winter. They have all taken place before food, include the wedding I shot in Ireland once.

That’s just my experience, yours are clearly different in Ireland.

Not sure how many weddings you’ve been to and you said you’ve been to a lot, more than us, things must be so different in Ireland in that they make things more difficult on purpose by shooting the group shots in the dark when there was a perfectly good hour or so between the ceremony and wedding breakfast to shoot it.
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We would shoot some stuff after the wedding meal with the couple but as you say group photos are always done much earlier in the day especially at winter weddings.



Anyway once the Z6 & Z7 have confirmed specs, I am probably gonna jump in as soon as they are available. I just have a couple of niggly things that I want to see confirmed first then we will probably ditch our D750's for these. At first was thinking of just getting z6's but now thinking 2 of each which would also allow us to ditch our D850's as well. If the confirmed specs don't give what I think they will I am ditching Nikon and getting Sony A9's.
 
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f/2.8 said:
The weather must be very different in the republic. I work in Northern Ireland and while we do occasionally use ocf for portraits with the bride and groom late on, we wouldn't use it for group photos. Since the turn of the year we have shot just under 30 weddings and haven't needed to use ocf flash at any of them. Although we have used ocf for some stuff but that was down to personal choice for a few shots of the bride and groom rather than group photos. Most wedding venues will have an area that is well lit enough to use when the weather is particularly bad but it's very rare that at some point during the day there won't be 10 minutes or so to knock out a few group photographs where it isn't p***ing it down. Although maybe our weather is just better than yours but I doubt it.

I also know quite a few local wedding photographers both here and in the republic and of those only one uses ocf a lot and he is quite an old school traditional guy. There are very few of those around any more. A lot of the old school guys do shoot everything with on camera flash but the on board flash and shoot everything at f/8 brigade are dying out fast.

I don't believe it has ever been the case that a large amount of wedding guys used ocf regularly especially not for group photos.



We would shoot some stuff after the wedding meal with the couple but as you say group photos are always done much earlier in the day especially at winter weddings.



Anyway once the Z6 & Z7 have confirmed specs, I am probably gonna jump in as soon as they are available. I just have a couple of niggly things that I want to see confirmed first then we will probably ditch our D750's for these. At first was thinking of just getting z6's but now thinking 2 of each which would also allow us to ditch our D850's as well. If the confirmed specs don't give what I think they will I am ditching Nikon and getting Sony A9's.
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If you're not getting pee'd on every other day from September onward, then yes, we are most definitely getting worse weather than you :D and I'm in Meath - not a million miles south of you. Yesterday it was raining here, but not 5 miles down the road, so it's not that surprising. Maybe the weddings I attend make use of the older school guys? There is quite a few of them in this county. I remember a guy from the Meath Chronicle came to the house to take our family photo when we were fund raising a few years back, and the guy was using a Nikon D1 - I was really surprised, thought those guys all used 1Dx or D4s, but then the image was printed about 4x5" so it didn't really matter.
 
Cagey75 said:
If you're not getting pee'd on every other day from September onward, then yes, we are most definitely getting worse weather than you :D and I'm in Meath - not a million miles south of you. Yesterday it was raining here, but not 5 miles down the road, so it's not that surprising. Maybe the weddings I attend make use of the older school guys? There is quite a few of them in this county. I remember a guy from the Meath Chronicle came to the house to take our family photo when we were fund raising a few years back, and the guy was using a Nikon D1 - I was really surprised, thought those guys all used 1Dx or D4s, but then the image was printed about 4x5" so it didn't really matter.
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You could be right there I would imagine that there is probably more old school guys around in the more rural areas, so it may be different somewhere like Meath. I honestly believe that in both the republic and here we have an incredibly large amount of very gifted wedding photographers (I wouldn't include myself here :D) some of the best wedding photographers in Europe operate from both of our countries, if it made sense to shoot a lot of ocf at a wedding they would be doing it.

I use ocf a lot for other types of photography away from weddings. It's just generally too much of a pain in the bum with the time constraints of a wedding to use it that much.

Dealing with not so good weather is just part of the job and occasionally you will get a really fun couple that don't mind standing in the p***ing rain while you grab a few photos, sometimes the bridal party will too, not had a family that are willing to do that yet though. Even on the wettest day though there is generally a break in the weather at some point and if not hotels etc. usually have at least one well lit area to use. Depends on the venue though we shoot a lot of budget weddings and the cheaper hotels etc. seem to always have an area with better lighting available than the more expensive private venues who tend to like everything dark & moody.

Anyway sorry to derail the thread.
 
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I shoot in meath a lot and I've not noticed it being especially more rainy than anywhere else. The west coast tends to get the most ferocious weather in my experience - biting wind and rain. That being said, the worst rain I've shot in was in Tuscany in July a few years ago. And Scotland is way more harsh in winter than Ireland.

To stay on topic, any word on z6/7 weather sealing?
 
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decigallen said:
Not a chance it'll have one card. No pro would buy it. It'll be xqd plus sd.
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You’d hope so, but Nikon do weird stuff sometimes ;) I’d be extremely surprised if there’s only one slot. I still don’t understand why they have two different formats, why not just two UHS-II slots? I’m glad my D850 has at least one SD slot though, XQD and UHS-II cards are crazy expensive.

We’ll know for sure in just over 6hours though, there’s a live stream on the Nikon site if anyone will be up at that time? (Not sure where in the world all the TP members are situated ;))
 
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snerkler said:
You’d hope so, but Nikon do weird stuff sometimes ;) I’d be extremely surprised if there’s only one slot. I still don’t understand why they have two different formats, why not just two UHS-II slots? I’m glad my D850 has at least one SD slot though, XQD and UHS-II cards are crazy expensive.

We’ll know for sure in just over 6hours though, there’s a live stream on the Nikon site if anyone will be up at that time? (Not sure where in the world all the TP members are situated ;))
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Lots of places saying one card slot now.

Ooh Nikon :(

If this is officially confirmed that rules me out.
 
One card slot would be a disastrous move on Nikon's part imho. Make that one slot a XQD slot and boom! :LOL:

decigallen said:
Not a chance it'll have one card. No pro would buy it. It'll be xqd plus sd.

The downside to this is that the sd will surely cripple the xqd card's speed unless they've found a way to work around it.
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The D500 is still fast enough with XQD qnd SD, and they have had a couple of years to work on the internal electronics.
 
Multiple sources confirming one card and it's XQD.

Seriously Nikon what were you thinking :confused::mad:
 
Surely only 1 card slot (XQD) would be a disastrous error?
 
f/2.8 said:
Lots of places saying one card slot now.

Ooh Nikon :(

If this is officially confirmed that rules me out.
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Over my 12 years of digital photography I've had batteries fail me, cameras fail me, lenses fail me, flashguns fail me, and remote triggers fail me. Note the plurals. But I've never had a card fail me except the one time I tried a cheap card.
 
Malfis said:
Surely only 1 card slot (XQD) would be a disastrous error?
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It really would. That's why I think the sources are wrong. Nikon like to cut corners and deliberately cripple some cameras, but this seems to defy any reason.

Just a week ago there were mockups showing what is now confirmed to be the AF-ON to be the image review button. When I said the mockups were probably wrong as it made no sense, I was torn to shreds by Nikon fanboys saying that it made perfect sense to have it there. Loads of angry young men online, telling me that 'no one even uses AF-ON.'
 
chris malcolm said:
Over my 12 years of digital photography I've had batteries fail me, cameras fail me, lenses fail me, flashguns fail me, and remote triggers fail me. Note the plurals. But I've never had a card fail me except the one time I tried a cheap card.
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I've had three (genuine) Sandisk Extreme Pro cards fail me us on different wedding shoots. Just because it hasn't happened to you, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
 
chris malcolm said:
Over my 12 years of digital photography I've had batteries fail me, cameras fail me, lenses fail me, flashguns fail me, and remote triggers fail me. Note the plurals. But I've never had a card fail me except the one time I tried a cheap card.
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That's not the reason to risk it, it's like "in 40 years of driving i've never had a car accident" is not a reason not to wear a seat belt, beside being the law.

An entire camera dying you can make contingency by having a 2nd body, the single card dying (like really dead) you can do very little about unless you can time travel.

At minimum you will spend the rest of the shoot worried sick until you can get home to try to recover it, how's that for test of character to carry on without the pressure of possibly losing all those photos shot? Do you tell them now or do you tell them later? and if they ask you how come you have no back up? Errrrrr "this is the first time that has ever happened!"

Or you can do without that pressure by having 2 card slots.

Sure people will go "How did we managed without it before?" 2 card slots are the standard now, or should be, it's progress, just because we used to live in caves once upon a time and wear leafs to cover our groin area doesn't mean we should still do it now. Progress.
 
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chris malcolm said:
Over my 12 years of digital photography I've had batteries fail me, cameras fail me, lenses fail me, flashguns fail me, and remote triggers fail me. Note the plurals. But I've never had a card fail me except the one time I tried a cheap card.
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Same here, had one fail in a compact camera but it was a no-name Chinese card I got free. I only ever use Sandisk since I started shooting dslr and not once had one fail. In the D800 I had a compact card and SD card, used the CFC as the back up and never took it out of the camera. But ... for professionals, they need that peace of mind, I don't so much, though i'd still be royally peeved if a card failed after taking some really nice images
 
I've never had a card fail on me but if I am shooting for a living or other people in general no way I'd use a body with one card. In fact I'd have two bodies also.

Well it's at least a XQD card slot which is kinda cool.
 
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Redundancy is not the only benefit of two card slots. Let’s await the exact position but I’d say two is needed to be taken seriously.
 
Brazo said:
Redundancy is not the only benefit of two card slots. Let’s await the exact position but I’d say two is needed to be taken seriously.
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many do video to one, stills to the other these days, which is also very handy, for vlogger/videographers
 
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Surely surely not Nikon. Then again for some reason they only put 1 in the D7500 and isn’t the 6Dii just one also?
 
JJ! said:
Surely surely not Nikon. Then again for some reason they only put 1 in the D7500 and isn’t the 6Dii just one also?
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That's Canon's way to make you get the 5D, but unless Nikon is bringing out a Z8 and Z9 shortly, I think these are the flagships models for their mirrorless line.
 
snerkler said:
Interesting to read that Nikon will also announce their lens road map with the Z cameras announcement. I wonder how quickly they can get a substantial lineup out. On average how many FE lenses have Sony made each year?
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Sony (including Sony/Zeiss) FE lenses, by year of announcement:
  • 2013: 5 (with launch of A7) - 28-70, 70-200/4, 24-70/4, 55/1.8, 35/2.8
  • 2014: 2 - 28-135 PZ, 16-35/4
  • 2015: 4 - 24-240, 90 Macro, 35/1.4, 28/2
  • 2016: 7 - 85/1.4, 70-200/2.8, 24-70/2.8, 50/1.8, 70-300, 50/1.4, 50 Macro - plus 1.4xTC and 2xTC
  • 2017: 6 - 85/1.8, 100/2.8 STF, 100-400, 16-35/2.8, 12-24, 24-105
  • 2018: 1 so far - 400/2.8
That's a total of 25 plus 2 TCs. During this time period (from mid-2013 to mid-2018), they've also introduced 3 E-mount lenses and 4 A-mount, for a grand total of 34.

Over the same time frame, Nikon have introduced 17 FX lenses, 12 DX and 4 "Nikon 1", for a grand total of 33.

The rumoured roadmap suggests Nikon will release 4 Z-mount lenses this year, and another 4 or 5 next year. That's going to be a big chunk of their lens development capability. It will take them a long time to catch up, if they ever do. (Though of course it can be argued that there's no screaming hurry, so long as F-mount lenses work well enough on the new system.)
 
StewartR said:
Sony (including Sony/Zeiss) FE lenses, by year of announcement:
  • 2013: 5 (with launch of A7) - 28-70, 70-200/4, 24-70/4, 55/1.8, 35/2.8
  • 2014: 2 - 28-135 PZ, 16-35/4
  • 2015: 4 - 24-240, 90 Macro, 35/1.4, 28/2
  • 2016: 7 - 85/1.4, 70-200/2.8, 24-70/2.8, 50/1.8, 70-300, 50/1.4, 50 Macro - plus 1.4xTC and 2xTC
  • 2017: 6 - 85/1.8, 100/2.8 STF, 100-400, 16-35/2.8, 12-24, 24-105
  • 2018: 1 so far - 400/2.8
That's a total of 25 plus 2 TCs. During this time period (from mid-2013 to mid-2018), they've also introduced 3 E-mount lenses and 4 A-mount, for a grand total of 34.

Over the same time frame, Nikon have introduced 17 FX lenses, 12 DX and 4 "Nikon 1", for a grand total of 33.

The rumoured roadmap suggests Nikon will release 4 Z-mount lenses this year, and another 4 or 5 next year. That's going to be a big chunk of their lens development capability. It will take them a long time to catch up, if they ever do. (Though of course it can be argued that there's no screaming hurry, so long as F-mount lenses work well enough on the new system.)
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Don't forget the teleside converters Sony released for FE28 and updated version for SEL20
 
Cagey75 said:
If you're not getting pee'd on every other day from September onward, then yes, we are most definitely getting worse weather than you :D and I'm in Meath - not a million miles south of you. Yesterday it was raining here, but not 5 miles down the road, so it's not that surprising. Maybe the weddings I attend make use of the older school guys? There is quite a few of them in this county. I remember a guy from the Meath Chronicle came to the house to take our family photo when we were fund raising a few years back, and the guy was using a Nikon D1 - I was really surprised, thought those guys all used 1Dx or D4s, but then the image was printed about 4x5" so it didn't really matter.
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They must sell a ton of umbrellas down your way :LOL:
 
SsSsSsSsSnake said:
They must sell a ton of umbrellas down your way :LOL:
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Always a sale somewhere on rain macs and wellies :ROFLMAO:

I'm actually originally from further down, what we used to call the "sunny south east" - But here in the upper midlands it's definitely boggier, wetter, colder ... makes me wonder why ol' James and Willy Orange chose to battle around here? :D
 
Raymond Lin said:
That's not the reason to risk it, it's like "in 40 years of driving i've never had a car accident" is not a reason not to wear a seat belt, beside being the law.

An entire camera dying you can make contingency by having a 2nd body, the single card dying (like really dead) you can do very little about unless you can time travel.

At minimum you will spend the rest of the shoot worried sick until you can get home to try to recover it, how's that for test of character to carry on without the pressure of possibly losing all those photos shot? Do you tell them now or do you tell them later? and if they ask you how come you have no back up? Errrrrr "this is the first time that has ever happened!"

Or you can do without that pressure by having 2 card slots.

Sure people will go "How did we managed without it before?" 2 card slots are the standard now, or should be, it's progress, just because we used to live in caves once upon a time and wear leafs to cover our groin area doesn't mean we should still do it now. Progress.
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True,but I find wearing a leaf quite liberating to be honest,just make sure it’s not a nettle :LOL:
 
chris malcolm said:
Over my 12 years of digital photography I've had batteries fail me, cameras fail me, lenses fail me, flashguns fail me, and remote triggers fail me. Note the plurals. But I've never had a card fail me except the one time I tried a cheap card.
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Good for you.

Last year I had 2 x 64 gb sd cards fail.

The year before I had a 32gb Sandisk compact flash fail.

A couple of years ago I had a Lexie 32gb compact flash card fail.

They where all expensive high speed cards.

Thankfully each time the back up cards where fine and no clients images where lost.
 
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