The camera is going in the bin !

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The sensor needs a clean.
 
If manual lenses are being used do they stop down to an appropriate aperture or do they remain fully/wide open, thereby over exposing? I have never used a manual lens on a modern camera (or for that matter on a film camera post 1980) so I maybe talking rubbish as far a how manual lenses work on a digital camera which expects to stop down when taking the shot and meters accordingly.
 
I have a similar problem with my Voigtländer R3M. Every image I take is severely underexposed. As in pitch-black. I've tried dozens of rolls of films (at various ISOs) and spent loads of time bracketing exposures. All to no avail. Everything through the viewfinder looks fine. The film advance is working correctly and I'm very careful when winding the film back once it's finished. I use a Sekonic L-308S light meter and I've checked this against a Lunasix F.

I'm pretty gutted. I was hoping a fully mechanical camera would be devoid of the complications that seem to afflict modern DSLRs.

Any suggestions?
 
adrianday said:
I have a similar problem with my Voigtländer R3M. Every image I take is severely underexposed. As in pitch-black. I've tried dozens of rolls of films (at various ISOs) and spent loads of time bracketing exposures. All to no avail. Everything through the viewfinder looks fine. The film advance is working correctly and I'm very careful when winding the film back once it's finished. I use a Sekonic L-308S light meter and I've checked this against a Lunasix F.

I'm pretty gutted. I was hoping a fully mechanical camera would be devoid of the complications that seem to afflict modern DSLRs.

Any suggestions?
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Adrian - open the camera back and fire the shutter whilst looking through it with the back open; try different shutter speeds and you should see if the shutter is working correctly.
 
MatBin said:
If manual lenses are being used do they stop down to an appropriate aperture or do they remain fully/wide open, thereby over exposing? I have never used a manual lens on a modern camera (or for that matter on a film camera post 1980) so I maybe talking rubbish as far a how manual lenses work on a digital camera which expects to stop down when taking the shot and meters accordingly.
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I only use manual lenses on a Sony a7rii, which isn't a Canon! As the lens isn't native, the mount adapter effective disables to automatic diaphragm and causes the lens to stop down to the marked aperture - it's only open fully if the aperture ring is set to open fully. Except in one situation - see the next paragraph. With a mirrorless camera, as the viewfinder shows what the sensor sees, this effect isn't perceived as a dimming on stopping down (and it also means that you can judge depth of field without peering in the dark).

The one exception I've found is with Canon FD lenses, which require a switch on the adapter to be set to "open" or "lock"; in one position, even if you set f/22 the lens will be fully open. If set to lock it will be closed down. Plus, the first Canon lens I tried had a faulty mechanism which meant that the switch setting was ineffective, and the lens remained wide open (in this case, at f/1.2)
 
adrianday said:
I have a similar problem with my Voigtländer R3M. Every image I take is severely underexposed. As in pitch-black. I've tried dozens of rolls of films (at various ISOs) and spent loads of time bracketing exposures. All to no avail. Everything through the viewfinder looks fine. The film advance is working correctly and I'm very careful when winding the film back once it's finished. I use a Sekonic L-308S light meter and I've checked this against a Lunasix F.

I'm pretty gutted. I was hoping a fully mechanical camera would be devoid of the complications that seem to afflict modern DSLRs.

Any suggestions?
Click to expand...

Literally dozens of films? I think I'd have stopped after two! As Fraser says, have a look at the shutter. I assume if you only have one lens you've also checked the aperture is working correctly - any fault should be even more obvious than a shutter problem.
 
MatBin said:
If manual lenses are being used do they stop down to an appropriate aperture or do they remain fully/wide open, thereby over exposing? I have never used a manual lens on a modern camera (or for that matter on a film camera post 1980) so I maybe talking rubbish as far a how manual lenses work on a digital camera which expects to stop down when taking the shot and meters accordingly.
Click to expand...

I've used manual Olympus Zuiko lenses on my Canon 20D via a dumb adapter. You set the aperture on the lens manually and it stays like that until you change it again. The camera and a manual lens usually work fine I aperture priority and manual mode. I didn't experience any problems like this but my first thought is the ISO and shutter speed combinations just look way off so the obvious thing to do would be to note where the exposure meter cursor is and check the results and adjust accordingly.

With all respect to the OP I think that he needs a fresh eye on the camera and lens just to check that he isn't missing something obvious as we all do from time to time :D
 
adrianday said:
I have a similar problem with my Voigtländer R3M. Every image I take is severely underexposed. As in pitch-black. I've tried dozens of rolls of films (at various ISOs) and spent loads of time bracketing exposures. All to no avail. Everything through the viewfinder looks fine. The film advance is working correctly and I'm very careful when winding the film back once it's finished. I use a Sekonic L-308S light meter and I've checked this against a Lunasix F.

I'm pretty gutted. I was hoping a fully mechanical camera would be devoid of the complications that seem to afflict modern DSLRs.

Any suggestions?
Click to expand...
Lens cap? ;)
 
Pound Coin said:
The sensor needs a clean.
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It does indeed, which proves the aperture is closing down.
So we’re definitely left with a choice between or combination of faulty meter and user error.
The frustrating part of which is that help was offered months ago.
 
I'm with Badger, bin the camera.
 
If these numbers are correct I think there's a clue there...

Stately home shot.
Canon = ISO 1,600, 1/500.
Olympus shot = ISO 64, 1/797.

Woman shot.
Canon = ISO 1,600, 1/180.
Olympus = ISO 64, 1/372
 
Just thinking outside the box a little.....is it possible to throw the photographer in the bin and keep the camera?

Although to be fair, 1600 ISO in bright sunshine has given me a bit of a laugh this morning.

One other thought that occurred to me. Over the years I've met several camera "experts" who "only ever shoot in manual darling". Invariably their exposures are all over the place and their actual understanding of how a camera meters is no better than anyone else.

It's a funny old game....
 
adrianday said:
I have a similar problem with my Voigtländer R3M. Every image I take is severely underexposed. As in pitch-black. I've tried dozens of rolls of films (at various ISOs) and spent loads of time bracketing exposures. All to no avail. Everything through the viewfinder looks fine. The film advance is working correctly and I'm very careful when winding the film back once it's finished. I use a Sekonic L-308S light meter and I've checked this against a Lunasix F.

I'm pretty gutted. I was hoping a fully mechanical camera would be devoid of the complications that seem to afflict modern DSLRs.

Any suggestions?
Click to expand...
Open the back and set a slow shutter speed now try ajusting the aperture while looking through as the shutter opens, does the aperture actually alter? is the shutter working properly, it's not uncommon for a "sticky" shutter/aperture in older cameras.
 
Where does the OP live? anybody near enough to pop around for a cuppa and a shufti at the camera to see if it's duff???
 
Fraser Euan White said:
Adrian - open the camera back and fire the shutter whilst looking through it with the back open; try different shutter speeds and you should see if the shutter is working correctly.
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Hi @Fraser Euan White , I've just done this and can confirm that the shutter if firing as I'd expect.

I'm keen to resolve this. I have to send my film away to be processed, scanned and printed. It's costing me an absolute fortune.
 
swanseamale47 said:
Open the back and set a slow shutter speed now try ajusting the aperture while looking through as the shutter opens, does the aperture actually alter? is the shutter working properly, it's not uncommon for a "sticky" shutter/aperture in older cameras.
Click to expand...
Hi @swanseamale47 , It's not an old camera! I bought it new a few years ago!! Some one said I could have bought a secondhand Leica but I was worried about the potential problems you describe. I thought it might be something to do with the film speed - I've tried everything from Pan F+ (50 ISO) to Delta 3200 (3200 ISO). Should I try colour film instead of black and white?
 
adrianday said:
Hi @Fraser Euan White , I've just done this and can confirm that the shutter if firing as I'd expect.

I'm keen to resolve this. I have to send my film away to be processed, scanned and printed. It's costing me an absolute fortune.
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Can you see any frames on the negatives at all or are they completely clear?
 
If you wish I can develop a film for you if you do a test. I can do it for cost if you wish. Or send camera as well and I can test.
 
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Very unlikely the chemicals are that far gone! If shutter is working and film isn't exposed at all (film completely clear) then as Phil says either the lens cap is on or the film isn't"t advancing.
 
Fraser Euan White said:
If you wish I can develop a film for you if you do a test. I can do it for cost if you wish. Or send camera as well and I can test.
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Hi @Fraser Euan White , Thanks for your very kind offer. I'd send you the camera but I'm using it to shoot a wedding at the weekend and I need to fly to the Maldives on Thursday. The bride and groom are insistent I shoot 35mm film (they're hipsters) and I'd hate to let them down on their big day.
 
adrianday said:
Hi @swanseamale47 , It's not an old camera! I bought it new a few years ago!! Some one said I could have bought a secondhand Leica but I was worried about the potential problems you describe. I thought it might be something to do with the film speed - I've tried everything from Pan F+ (50 ISO) to Delta 3200 (3200 ISO). Should I try colour film instead of black and white?
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Both have a fair bit of latitude, trouble is we cant see what your seeing.
I'd be tempted to try a normal outdoor scene (bright day) around a 100 iso B+W, F8 and go through a big range of shutter, from say a 1/15 to 1/1000 and see how they look, you should clearly see a difference and one should be half decent at least. If they are all still too dark clearly something is wrong somewhere. Either the shutter isn't opening properly or the aperture is sticking for some reason. I'm assuming the developing is ok, have you tried another identical film form a different camera in the same dev as a check?
I did once have a batch of dev that turned out to be X-ray developer in the wrong bottle, handy if you want to dev in 30 seconds, not so good if your working on 14 mins or whatever dev time.
 
adrianday said:
Hi @Fraser Euan White , The negatives are perfectly clear. The contact sheets are black as are the scans and prints. Do you think the processing company could be to blame? What if their chemicals are off?
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this crossed with my answer. No edge marking??? No development! Thats what it sounds like, maybe fixer first?
 
adrianday said:
Hi @Fraser Euan White , Thanks for your very kind offer. I'd send you the camera but I'm using it to shoot a wedding at the weekend and I need to fly to the Maldives on Thursday. The bride and groom are insistent I shoot 35mm film (they're hipsters) and I'd hate to let them down on their big day.
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I hope this is a joke? Your not seriously going to shoot a wedding on a camera you suspect to have a fault? Ok it sounds like it might be the developing but thats a huge risk mate.
 
adrianday said:
Hi @Fraser Euan White , Thanks for your very kind offer. I'd send you the camera but I'm using it to shoot a wedding at the weekend and I need to fly to the Maldives on Thursday. The bride and groom are insistent I shoot 35mm film (they're hipsters) and I'd hate to let them down on their big day.
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Well you're going to if the camera's knackered aren't you?

I'd get a backup camera asap and double up on the shots.
 
swanseamale47 said:
Both have a fair bit of latitude, trouble is we cant see what your seeing.
I'd be tempted to try a normal outdoor scene (bright day) around a 100 iso B+W, F8 and go through a big range of shutter, from say a 1/15 to 1/1000 and see how they look, you should clearly see a difference and one should be half decent at least. If they are all still too dark clearly something is wrong somewhere. Either the shutter isn't opening properly or the aperture is sticking for some reason. I'm assuming the developing is ok, have you tried another identical film form a different camera in the same dev as a check?
I did once have a batch of dev that turned out to be X-ray developer in the wrong bottle, handy if you want to dev in 30 seconds, not so good if your working on 14 mins or whatever dev time.
Click to expand...
Hi @swanseamale47 , I did a bracketing test a few weeks ago. The aperture works perfectly. It's a 40mm,f1/1.4 Nokton Classic. As I mentioned, I send my film away so probably can't guarantee it'll be processed in the same developer. I've sent many separate batches of films to the same place and they always come back the same. Could it be something to do with the postal service? Would a courier be better??
 
Ewww… is it the hot weather, my imagination, or does it smell of troll in here? :puke:
 
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adrianday said:
Hi @Fraser Euan White , Thanks for your very kind offer. I'd send you the camera but I'm using it to shoot a wedding at the weekend and I need to fly to the Maldives on Thursday. The bride and groom are insistent I shoot 35mm film (they're hipsters) and I'd hate to let them down on their big day.
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Satire is not dead after all!

swanseamale47 said:
Open the back and set a slow shutter speed now try ajusting the aperture while looking through as the shutter opens, does the aperture actually alter? is the shutter working properly, it's not uncommon for a "sticky" shutter/aperture in older cameras.
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If this were a real problem you'd just need to look at the lens from the front - the R3M is a rangefinder, so the ring directly controls the aperture blades mechanically (there's no need for SLR-style 'open aperture' metering).
 
adrianday said:
Hi @swanseamale47 , I really don't know what the problem is. I find it hard to believe myself.
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Rather than taking shots and getting the negs come back clear time and again wouldnt it be a good idea to send it off to a repairer, I believe the guys in the Film section know of a reliable person.
In the meantime I have a couple of film cameras you are welcome to borrow and as you live close to me you can drop in to my home or work and collect if you want rather than ruin the B&G's big day. (Home is Harpenden, work is Hemel)
 
Edited! Actually, no, it's too warm for this stuff.
 
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adrianday said:
Hi @GreenNinja67 , I've got a Fuji Instax Mini 90 NEO Classic I could use. But I'm worried about getting enlargements from the prints.
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No problem, Adrian. Just divide each group shot into a dozen separate close ups, and then reassemble them as an elaborate collage using a Pritt stick and some high quality backing card. Repeat as necessary for everyone who wants a picture. This requires some patience from the guests, but the results are worth it!
 
Retune said:
the R3M is a rangefinder, so the ring directly controls the aperture blades mechanically (there's no need for SLR-style 'open aperture' metering).
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Hi @Retune, This is one of the reasons I bought it. It's fully manual and mechanical. No need for batteries! Everything moves as expected. Nothing rattles and nothing's out of place. I've had lots of other film cameras in the past and have never experienced anything quite like this before.
 
MatBin said:
Rather than taking shots and getting the negs come back clear time and again wouldnt it be a good idea to send it off to a repairer, I believe the guys in the Film section know of a reliable person.
In the meantime I have a couple of film cameras you are welcome to borrow and as you live close to me you can drop in to my home or work and collect if you want rather than ruin the B&G's big day. (Home is Harpenden, work is Hemel)
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Thanks for your kind offer. Unfortunately, I won't be able to take you up on it. Have just discovered my passport needs renewing. Have to go to Peterborough tomorrow to get a new one.
 
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