The final camera decision...

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TGphoto

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So I have asked this question in some way or another a few times on a few threads but I have finally come to the day where I will make a final decision and hopefully stick by it.

Thanks so much to all the people that have already contributed to my conundrum!

These are my options - both similar prices but rather different kits:

Sony A7 + Kit lens (27-70mm) + either Sony 28mm f2 or Olympus 21mm 3.5

or

Panasonic GX8 + Panasonic 12-35mm f2.8 - would probably get a prime as well with this option


Do I go for a bigger sensor or a better lens on a system with more affordable lenses?!

Uses are primarily landscape (so need a wide/ultra-wide and not sure 28mm is wide enough) - also want to do some traveling so needs to be easily mobile. Landscapes will consist of ones in good light, sunsets and sunrises.

I print usually up to A3 size.

Want to use it to make some travel videos as well as a better alternative to my GoPro.

I'm a stickler for wanting a very sharp image but won't be looking at this on a 200% crop to nit pick.

Main worry for the systems:

A7 - Cost of lenses
GX8 - IQ for landscapes

3rd option is a Used 6D and 17-40MM For £1050 in the classifieds

Once again, sorry for asking so many times and thanks for all the help up to this point..I'm almost there!
 
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Pick the system you can afford. Sony has no 4k, the m43 lens is way better and faster than the a7 kit lens so there goes the iso advantage. Only the 28 has the advantage.
 
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For travelling m4/3 is very hard to beat. I used to have an extensive Canon setup but invested in m4/3 for travelling and now use m4/3 90% of the time.

Also when travelling I find that I'm usually shooting in pretty good light so it's OK to use slow (but light) lenses most of the time. For low light the f/1.8-f/2.0 m4/3 primes are excellent quality, light and compact as well.

Finally m4/3 is hands down the most affordable system as a whole. There are some excellent bargains in the Oly and Panasonic line-up.
 
For landscape I'd go with Sony for the dynamic range and 3:2 format (as supposed to 4:3 of m43). Just my 2p...
 
Tom Green said:
Cheers for the responses so far!

The A7 looks so good and £619 was an amazing price to get it for but I truly believe that Sony have priced their lenses all wrong!
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Some of them are overpriced for sure especially APS-C lenses. But the FF lenses are very competitive in performance for the price.

But unlike canon and Nikon there is some lack of budget options. This is getting better especially with 3rd parties jumping in to the party but it's a new system so will be a while to settle down as well as canikon.

But you can adapt a wide variety of lenses. For landscapes where you don't AF this is great.
 
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I'd say a Canon is a good option... :LOL:

The Sony Zeiss lenses are very good, but you pay a price for them. Also, as said, the FF lenses are competitive for their performance. Aren't there some alternative lens options in the Sony mount that you could look at? If you aren't fussed about MF, there are some great lenses around that you can adapt too.
 
twist said:
Pick the system you can afford. Sony has no 4k, the m43 lens is way better and faster than the a7 kit lens so there goes the iso advantage. Only the 28 has the advantage.
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Cheers.......shame I can't find an example as I am looking for how they are around f6-f10 really as that my most used zone. 4k is a factor.
 
Factor in budget for lots of spare batteries if you're travelling a lot, the Sony in particular eats them like I drink wine but all mirrorless cameras are pretty thirsty in that respect...

To be honest, given everything you've said I reckon the Canon is probably the best choice for you, but you may as well just buy something and see as no amount of internet searching will answer your questions. We all have different requirements.
 
I don't believe landscapes are only meant to be shot above f/8, same as I don't think you need wide angles landscapes. You can get some interesting shots shooting wider and longer lenses.

Here... A77M2 w/ sigma 105mm f/2.8 macro at f/4

16691693426_94f2f23c6f_b.jpg


Unless you are a particularly zoomy kinda person I say skip the kit lens get a 3 primes set up - FE28 or samyang 35mm/2.8, FE 85mm/1.8 (and my OM 21 :D )

edit: for landscapes I wouldn't go anywhere near canon... I'd get a brand DSLR or mirrorless that uses Sony sensor.
 
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nandbytes said:
I don't believe landscapes are only meant to be shot above f/8, same as I don't think you need wide angles landscapes. You can get some interesting shots shooting wider and longer lenses.

Here... A77M2 w/ sigma 105mm f/2.8 macro at f/4

16691693426_94f2f23c6f_b.jpg


Unless you are a particularly zoomy kinda person I say skip the kit lens get a 3 primes set up - FE28 or samyang 35mm/2.8, FE 85mm/1.8 (and my OM 21 :D )

edit: for landscapes I wouldn't go anywhere near canon... I'd get a brand DSLR or mirrorless that uses Sony sensor.
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I prefer primes to be honest. The new Samyang looks very nice - I'd be tempted (if I pick the a7) to sell the kit lens, take the 28 f2 back. The buy the Samyang 35 2.8 and yours or the Samyang 14mm. Decisions!
 
Orangecroc said:
It seems you might be at the point where you just need to go into a store and hold them and see which of the two feels most comfortable.
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+1! This is really good advice. Personally I didn't like the A7 at all, even though it sounded great on paper. I'd rather carry a 6D with polariser / Nd grads.
 
BacktotheFuji said:
+1! This is really good advice. Personally I didn't like the A7 at all, even though it sounded great on paper. I'd rather carry a 6D with polariser / Nd grads.
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Tried this.....can't find the GX8 in store anywhere! A7 I have held and it feels small but I want a smaller system as thats why I sold my 7D - smaller system and better IQ.
 
Tom Green said:
Tried this.....can't find the GX8 in store anywhere! A7 I have held and it feels small but I want a smaller system as thats why I sold my 7D - smaller system and better IQ.
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So why are you looking at m43? If you want smaller the only thing smaller with a ff sensor is the a7 series or apsc Fuji and Sony a63/500.
 
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Tom Green said:
Tried this.....can't find the GX8 in store anywhere! A7 I have held and it feels small but I want a smaller system as thats why I sold my 7D - smaller system and better IQ.
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Have you tried shooting with the a7 though? There are a lot of fans and a lot of non-fans... :) The shutter sound alone was pretty nasty :D As a random alternative, have you considered a used Samsung NX1? I know the system is dead, but the lenses were pretty decent.
 
With an apsc sensor you'll save on lens sizes and body, a7 you'll only save on the body over ff DSLR.
 
twist said:
So why are you looking at m43? If you want smaller the only thing smaller with a ff sensor is the a7 series or apsc Fuji and Sony a63/500.
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To be fair, the IQ of modern m43 is better than any recent Canon APSC sensor I'm aware of.

But irrespective, any modern camera has good enough IQ unless you are pushing limits.
 
General reply here:

Looking at M4/3 due to size and size of lenses.
Looking at A7 due to being a compact full frame and trying to work out how I can make it into a cost effective compact system
 
park cameras have at least one GX8 12-60 kit in london, at least we did this morning -) though i think you might be better off with the G80 tbh
 
twist said:
The native FE af lenses are generally the same size as the DSLR equiv.
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Perhaps for a lot of lenses its true but not all lenses which is what your comment implied.
There are some small lenses, I used to carry A7+FE35 in my jacket pockets easily. Good luck doing that with any DSLR let alone a FF one.
 
twist said:
The native FE af lenses are generally the same size as the DSLR equiv.
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I think the for the best FF size/weight form factor is the Sony A7 paired with the Zeiss 35mm f2.8 and Zeiss 55mm f1.8, most of the other FE lenses just make it a bulkier setup but still not too bad.
 
nandbytes said:
Perhaps for a lot of lenses its true but not all lenses which is what your comment implied.
There are some small lenses, I used to carry A7+FE35 in my jacket pockets easily. Good luck doing that with any DSLR let alone a FF one.
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And a DSLR 35mm 2.8 would also be around the same size as the FE. I was obviously talking about native af that's Apple's and Apple's.
 
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Well we haven't got a DSLR lens to compare with :p
FE28 is small, the 12-24mm f/4 and 16-35mm/2.8 are definitely smaller compared to DSLR equivalents. So is the 24-70mm f/4. FE55 is pretty small to but once again no DSLR equivalents to compare with.

Well if rumours are to be believed sigma is making a fast 35mm. Let's see how that turns out ;)
 
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twist said:
And a DSLR 35mm 2.8 would also be around the same size as the FE. I was obviously talking about native af that's Apple's and Apple's.
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Perhaps but still think the A7 with these two lenses is unbeatable for FF IQ in a small package.

The Sony A7 paired with the Zeiss 35mm f2.8 is about the same depth as the Nikon D610 body alone :D
http://camerasize.com/compact/#487.394,486.333,ha,t

The Zeiss 55mm f1.8 setup is similar in depth to the Nikon D610 with the Nikkor 50mm but obviously the Zeiss has 5mm more reach and that lovely Zeiss pop!
http://camerasize.com/compact/#487.395,486.353,ha,t
 
Riz_Guru said:
Perhaps but still think the A7 with these two lenses is unbeatable for FF IQ in a small package.

The Sony A7 paired with the Zeiss 35mm f2.8 is about the same depth as the Nikon D610 body alone :D
http://camerasize.com/compact/#487.394,486.333,ha,t

The Zeiss 55mm f1.8 setup is similar in depth to the Nikon D610 with the Nikkor 50mm but obviously the Zeiss has 5mm more reach and that lovely Zeiss pop!
http://camerasize.com/compact/#487.395,486.353,ha,t
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But I was talking about lens size and said the difference lies in the body or was I wrong?

Never saw much special in the 55 tbh. It was sharp but not much pop imo.
 
nandbytes said:
I don't believe landscapes are only meant to be shot above f/8, same as I don't think you need wide angles landscapes. You can get some interesting shots shooting wider and longer lenses.

Here... A77M2 w/ sigma 105mm f/2.8 macro at f/4

16691693426_94f2f23c6f_b.jpg


Unless you are a particularly zoomy kinda person I say skip the kit lens get a 3 primes set up - FE28 or samyang 35mm/2.8, FE 85mm/1.8 (and my OM 21 :D )

edit: for landscapes I wouldn't go anywhere near canon... I'd get a brand DSLR or mirrorless that uses Sony sensor.
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Or A6000, 12mm f2 Samyang, 24mm f1,8 Sony or 30mm f1,4 Sigma and 60mm f2,8 Sigma.
 
twist said:
But I was talking about lens size and said the difference lies in the body or was I wrong?
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You are not wrong, it holds true for a good majority of lenses. But there are also some lenses that are smaller than DSLR equivalent. I gave three such examples above.
 
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nandbytes said:
You are not wrong, it holds true for a good majority of lenses. But there are also some lenses that are smaller than DSLR equivalent. I gave three such examples above.
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But we could also argue some FE lenses are larger than the DSLR equivalent.
 
soeren said:
Or A6000, 12mm f2 Samyang, 24mm f1,8 Sony or 30mm f1,4 Sigma and 60mm f2,8 Sigma.
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I know I'm biased (as my Samyang 12/2 and Sony 50/1.8 are in the classifieds!) but the A6000/Samyang is an awesome combination for landscapes. Tiny, light, takes filters using a standard Cokin P sized holder or screw in and delivers great results from corner to corner.

If you're considering M43 for landscapes I'd definitely suggest you include an A6K as well as an option. Obviously, it doesn't have 4K but the 1080 video is excellent.
 
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twist said:
But we could also argue some FE lenses are larger than the DSLR equivalent.
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Yes some of them are larger but in those cases only slightly. When they are smaller they are a fair amount smaller.
 
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