The Photographer's Bag Dealer trying it on?

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http://stores.ebay.co.uk/The-Photographers-Bag





Hi all some help please if possible, I sold all of may camera gear on eBay to a dealer, I wanted collection only as it was a lot, studio lights everything, the dealer could see it was for collection but asked me to post it, I agreed, I had to then find a box parcel it up get to a collection point which I did so they could have it. The exif data said for the shutter count was 1988 which I mentioned in the listing, They emailed me to say the shutter count is double that, so my 2 year old camera has just under 5000 clicks,.

They are wanting to service the camera to fix any errors at a cost of £25 pounds which they want in a refund to cover a service cost.

I'm not naming them but this stinks a little to me as why would you service a camera with no faults other than a disputed click count?

Personally I think they are trying to hold me over a barrel regarding feedback I'm going to get negative because it's my word against there's.


So far they have said

I falsely advertised it
It was inaccurate
An error
Then went on to say I can honestly advertise it later if the deem to return it.

Sorry for the rant.

So what would be my best cause of action get them to return it do I take there word

How do I know it's my camera showing the shutter count??

Feeling peaved.



Sorry admin if I'm wrong section please move if you need to.
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Do you have any tangible proof of the shutter count when you sent it to them and how did you get the count?
 
I guess "How important is it?" is the question. Is it worth arguing over? I know there's a principal involved, but if you can write off the £25 and forget about then whole thing, you'll be the one having happier days. "Resentment is the poison you drink hoping someone else will die."

Another option is to have him return the entire lot. I had a guy pitch up to buy my broken guitar. It was on eBay with *lots* of pics and detail of the damage, and clearly sold as broken. He actually said "I didn't realise it would be this broken. I'll give you £30 for it." (when the auction closed at £40). I told him no and that I'd just cancel the auction. He started to get shirty about "driving all this way" and my wife stuck her head round the door and told him to f*ck off out of our house. He did. if you're peeved enough, get him to return it all (at his expense) and fully refund him. You'll be out of pocket the postage, but he'll have nothing.

Last option is to fight it. If you have proof of shutter count that'll help. 5000 clicks isn't a lot. Is there any manufacturer info on expected lifespan? Lessens his case if the manufacturer says 500k clicks is "average" for instance. What percentage is £25 of the camera value?

There are some nobs on eBay, but my experience is that most people are OK. As usual, the few spoil it for the many.
 
Having seen from the other thread who the buyer is then they clearly have a track record, report them to eBay, you won't be the first.
 
Thanks for the replys.

I deleted the programmes off the laptop so have no way of proving the shutter count DOH, it was the last of my DLSR photography gear I'm going compact LOL , the life expectancy of the 700d is 100,000 clicks, they got all my equipment for a very good price.


Guess what my camera's up for sale I know exactly how I tied the power lead to the charger, I will report them to ebay, they can not keep getting away with this holding people over a barrel it's a kind of extortion, I have a 100% on here and on Ebay so I suppose what price is integrity.

I'm not into trashing anyone's business, but TBH I would have given them a partial refund if they had said it had a dirty sensor or dust on the mirror, I know the shutter count was below 2000.

Harlequin suppose i couldn't borrow your wife for a one minute phone call to the dealer, that was a classic.
 
Do a search for alldigital0869
 
First off and taking no sides there shutter count is possibly right as exif data wouldn't be accurate . But I can't see how they can do a service for £25 that's just purely trying it on .theres no such thing as a £25 service on a camera . If they have paid you be carefull they don't complain to PayPal I would be gutted like you but it's your choice whether you think you can take it further ,letting us have the dealers name and e.bay details would hurt him far more than you
 
Caveat emptor. Tell them to prove what they say, or go away.

Did you get the 'right' price for your kit? That would determine whether or not to tell them to return it.

In the meantime, a pre-emptive complaint to eBay wouldn't hurt, especially as they seem to be adopting bullying tactics.
 
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Personally I think they are trying to hold me over a barrel regarding feedback I'm going to get negative because it's my word against there's..

Have you left feedback for them yet? It's a two-way street!
Play them at their own game on shutter count, they absolve themselves of responsibility for shutter count accuracy in all their camera listings.
 
Hi thanks again,

They got it for a very good price,
2 interfit lights stands with trigger leads ETC,
2 Brollies,
50mm 1.4 new,
canon 700d, filters,
canon 430exII
tripod
£550.00 all boxed as new.


whoever messages has called me dishonest, and accused me of false and incorrect advertising, there really going for the throat.

the item was for collection but they asked if I would post it, which I did it all took time and effort well so much for being nice, if £25 is there breaking point then so be it.

The fights on.

Not bothered about Neg feedback, I know it's all weighted against me, they are a top 10,000 ebay buyer, if they think they can affect me then they have a fight on there hands.

In my view it's jolly bad form.
 
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Have you left feedback for them yet? It's a two-way street!
Play them at their own game on shutter count, they absolve themselves of responsibility for shutter count accuracy in all their camera listings.


I don't think a seller can leave Neg feedback.

I have reported to ebay, but I don't think I will get anywhere.
 
Harlequin suppose i couldn't borrow your wife for a one minute phone call to the dealer, that was a classic.

I'd say yes, but I guarantee it would make the situation worse. She's a fiery lass, but I love her to bits.

Edit to add: My wife actually gets a lot out of actually ringing the eBay people up to explain the situation to a human. One of the few times I'd recommend trying to ring them and speak to them. She sells designer shoes and dresses and occasionally gets someone trying it on saying it's fake. She's not lost one yet, but she's found it more useful to deal with eBay rather than a buyer.

Your mileage may vary!
 
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Offering a full refund and accepting the items back is (used to be) considered good enough by eBay for them to side with you. Just be wary of getting empty boxes.
 
First off and taking no sides there shutter count is possibly right as exif data wouldn't be accurate . But I can't see how they can do a service for £25 that's just purely trying it on .theres no such thing as a £25 service on a camera . If they have paid you be carefull they don't complain to PayPal I would be gutted like you but it's your choice whether you think you can take it further ,letting us have the dealers name and e.bay details would hurt him far more than you

I've been very careful not to name them at the moment, don't want to get TP in the firing line.

Speaking of lines/crossing there message are somewhat defamatory.
.
 
Offering a full refund and accepting the items back is (used to be) considered good enough by eBay for them to side with you. Just be wary of getting empty boxes.


Yes you're right, I weighed the box before I sent it 11KG and photographed the packing process, I would want it returning exactly as I sent it and in Mint condition, before any refund is given.
 
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Offering a full refund and accepting the items back is (used to be) considered good enough by eBay for them to side with you. Just be wary of getting empty boxes.
The seller has to pay for the return now. selling on ebay is mega risky now. Returns are at the sellers cost and no neg feedback can be left.
 
You can always upload your latest jpg to 'camerashuttercount.com' which should be able to extract it from the exif.
 
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The seller has to pay for the return now. selling on ebay is mega risky now. Returns are at the sellers cost and no neg feedback can be left.

So true, but an expearance can be left on TP, I find the whole thing despicable is it really worth £25 quid, after the remarks they made about me they've still not twigged it's just boils down there word against mine.
 
You can always upload your latest jpg to 'camerashuttercount.com' which should be able to extract it from the exif.


Hi I would, but the last images are on the full size SD card which went with the camera and I deleted them 2 weeks ago when the camera was very first listed, I've been using my Sony Alfa A7 for months
 
So true, but an expearance can be left on TP, I find the whole thing despicable is it really worth £25 quid, after the remarks they made about me they've still not twigged it's just boils down there word against mine.
I am getting a bit lost with this now. If it is that they the buyer are asking you for £25 for a service "to fix any errors" (whatever that means) then don't you just not pay it?
Or if you are considering paying it then go specific with them. Ask them "pease can you provide evidence of the shutter count" and or ask "what is it that is wrong with camera that requires a service?" wait for the answer and take it from there but pin them down. If evidence of the shutter count is produced and you were wrong pay them. If there is evidence the camera needs £25 worth of work pay them. Let them know you are willing to pay if evidence is produced.
 
I am getting a bit lost with this now. If it is that they the buyer are asking you for £25 for a service "to fix any errors" (whatever that means) then don't you just not pay it?
Or if you are considering paying it then go specific with them. Ask them "pease can you provide evidence of the shutter count" and or ask "what is it that is wrong with camera that requires a service?" wait for the answer and take it from there but pin them down. If evidence of the shutter count is produced and you were wrong pay them. If there is evidence the camera needs £25 worth of work pay them. Let them know you are willing to pay if evidence is produced.
Unfortunately though the dealer will no doubt conjure up some evidence. It's a catch 22
 
I am getting a bit lost with this now. If it is that they the buyer are asking you for £25 for a service "to fix any errors" (whatever that means) then don't you just not pay it?
Or if you are considering paying it then go specific with them. Ask them "pease can you provide evidence of the shutter count" and or ask "what is it that is wrong with camera that requires a service?" wait for the answer and take it from there but pin them down. If evidence of the shutter count is produced and you were wrong pay them. If there is evidence the camera needs £25 worth of work pay them. Let them know you are willing to pay if evidence is produced.

They are just assuming I would go along with it and refund the £25.00 because,

A I need to sell It.
B I want/need the money.
C I don't want a return.
D worried about negative feedback.

Well guess what mr dealer none of the above apply to me. this is about Integrity.

I have asked them but still awaiting a reply, when it's over I will post the messages which went between us on here, these bully tactics don't work with me.

The £25 pounds is purely being used as leverage to extort extra out of a seller who has very little they can do in retaliation based on the Ebay system, and they damn well know it, I've not been on here for 8 years without picking up a few tips on how some dealers operate, to squeeze a few extra quid out of ours pockets to fill their coffers.

Photography is an expensive hobby and they know some people have vast amounts of money tied up in it, they're banking on that person selling needing the cash and willing to roll over and dance to their tune.

Well as an offspin, if my actions get them to think twice about doing it again to someone else then good.

Scenario.

Hi Mr camera serviceman, can you service my camera.
Yes customer what's up with it.
Nothing mr service man.
Why do you want it servicing ???
Because it's supposedly got 2500 more clicks than I was told.
How many shutter counts in total
4988. Mr serviceman
Yeh I'll service it, (rubs hands)
How much
Errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr....£25,00
Great
Just leave it on the counter and pick it up in an hour.

Edit to say it could be a servicewomen.
 
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I am very bloody minded and would ask them to return the lot even if it cost me money, as you say it's about principles
 
It's your call but I don't have the patience to argue about this sort of thing. FWIW, I'd either:
  1. Pay the £25, put it down to experience, and move on; or
  2. Decline to pay and instruct them to return my gear
 
Hi all yes I've been paid , the funny thing is all my gears for sale on there site, so without edgeing my bets I'd say it's all puff and wind for a bit extra

I will copy my last eBay message to them .

Dear whoever,

Putting aside the defamatory comments for now, please feel free to return the items making sure they are packaged exactly as I sent them. Once the items have been received I will check the condition of them to make sure they are in the mint condition I sent them. If I am satisfied that no damage has been caused I will refund you. You must advise me of when the parcel is going to be delivered. Remember, this was collection only and I am not responsible for the cost of the return postage - that will be down to you. Consider it a favour from me that I was prepared to send it by courier. I am wasting no more time on this matter apart from to say you show jolly bad form for the sake of £25. I would be grateful if any further correspondence is kept to a professional level and to the point rather than accusations about my honesty, false advertising and integrity.
 
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The camera has sold, but the rest of the gear is on there site.


Thanks everyone for the support it's nice to have somewhere to sound of and read balanced opinions .
 
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You could always pop around to the house in Dudley to discuss the issue with her! :D
 
I'd be better off asking Mrs Harlequin she shows true spirit, I'm a bit of a wimp really.
 
Now they've sold it on, they can whistle for any refund! They haven't had time to get it "serviced" (depending of course of when you actually did the deal and sent it all off) properly - maybe got a bloke out the back of the shop to have a look at it and try to charge YOU £25 for the privilege.
 
I'd like to know who the dealer is. I get the feeling everyone else does, except me.

I have said on previous post I do not use ebay. I have just completed another deal with MPB. As ever, very smooth, no issues and reasonable price received. TBH whether I am buying or selling I always end up dealing with them.
 
They are an eBay store called.

The photographers bag

http://stores.ebay.co.uk/The-Photographers-Bag/_i.html

I had my gear down for collection only they pestered me to send it to them.

I have over 600 pos feedback on eBay because I list things as honestly as I can so never had a problem like this, but this was a manufactured false problem invented by an unscrupulous person with no other purpose than exstorting money.
 
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