AGFA VISTA 400 @ Poundland

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#41
What's the grain like on this? Is it with keeping a stock of Vista 200 or is this close enough for the kind of shots ones uses Vista for?
According to the DX number it's Fuji Superia 400 so I imagine it'll be similar if not better grain wise compared to the 200 as Fuji C200 is quite an old emulsion (this is assuming its the latest Superia 400 version and not older stuff which has been kept in frozen storage and repackaged).

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tikkathreebarrel
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#47
Be interesting to find out what it is as there are practically no 'cheap' 400 speed films to my knowledge - it'll likely be a Fuji product as they make nearly all the Agfa branded films (minus the B&W). @tikkathreebarrel if you could give me the number on the 400+ (beneath where the barcode is [just where the film comes out]) then I should be able to work out what it is from my list.
806283? or B/76256640
 
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#48
According to the DX number it's Fuji Superia 400 so I imagine it'll be similar if not better grain wise compared to the 200 as Fuji C200 is quite an old emulsion (this is assuming its the latest Superia 400 version and not older stuff which has been kept in frozen storage and repackaged).

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That is what I was thinking C200 is hardly fine grained.
 
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#49
The first one - same as the one I found before online so its definitely Superia 400. To be honest theres only really Fuji Superia 400 and Kodak Ultra 400 in the 400 speed consumer market these days so it would have been one of the two. The DXn number corresponds to the latest version of Superia 400 (as of 2009 when the i3a list was last published) so it is very likely exactly the same stuff as Fuji is selling currently.

That is what I was thinking C200 is hardly fine grained.
Superia 400 was not bad grain wise the last time I used it, but by default mini-labs do apply light grain reduction automatically to any films of 400 and above so that may be part of the reason. I'll compare some similar past Superia 400 shots with some C200/Vista 200+ ones tomorrow, but I think the Superia will probably be way better as C200 is based on a very old emulsion (apparently dating from the late 80's to early 90's) and film technology has improved immeasurably since then - I wouldn't be surprised if todays modern 400 speed emulsions looked better than past 100 speed ones. Its exactly the same with Kodak and their "Colour Plus 200" which is the exact same as VR200 (based on the DXn number) which was released originally in ~1986 (assuming its the improved version over the 1982 original).
 

excalibur2

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#50
Well this is actually even better value than the 200, as I looked around the internet and found someone who had put up the DX code for Vista+ 400, and according to my list from the i3a it corresponds to...

Fuji Superia 400! O.K I don't know if it'll be the latest version, but considering how much most places sell it for a £1 is a bloody good bargain! Just to confirm it, if anyone else has some Vista+ 400 then if they could give me the code (the number just above where the film comes out) that would be really helpful.

Sam

What is this "to my list from the i3a" you speak of ? There are so many guesses as what is Agfa Vista plus 200 that I've given up (h'mm I wonder if anyone has written to Fuji and got an honest answer ;) ) , well someone by hearsay (not recent), on the net (no link), has compared Vista 200 and 400 and says it's the same film :rolleyes:...plausible as Ilford did that fiddle about 40 years ago rating their FP3 (or whatever it was then) from 64 to 125 ASA and of course sold more film compared to other makes that were rated slower.
 
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#51
a tonne of it in the Chelmsford store so i got 10 rolls. Will stick a roll through it soon and post the results up.

Surely youd notice the exposures being all to cock though if it was just re labeled 200.
 
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#52
What is this "to my list from the i3a" you speak of ? There are so many guesses as what is Agfa Vista plus 200 that I've given up (h'mm I wonder if anyone has written to Fuji and got an honest answer ;) ) , well someone by hearsay (not recent), on the net (no link), has compared Vista 200 and 400 and says it's the same film :rolleyes:...plausible as Ilford did that fiddle about 40 years ago rating their FP3 (or whatever it was then) from 64 to 125 ASA and of course sold more film compared to other makes that were rated slower.
Brian, the i3a (International Imaging Industry Association) is/was an organisation that supervised film and photography standards, and amongst other things they were responsible for the DX number system. The DX number and barcode identify the film type to processing machinery so that the correct profile etc can be applied, and from these you can work out what film is actually in the cartridge by converting the number to two identifying 'parts'. The i3a publish a list which says what these numbers actually correspond to. Manufacturers were assigned DX numbers to use for their films, and the list was updated periodically to say what they corresponded to.

The simplest way to find out what it is is to put the number into the DXn simulator (http://www.imageaircraft.com.au/DXsim/ [where it says "barcode" and then press enter]) and get the two DX number parts - the simulator will also give what the film is automatically if its in its database, but it uses the older 2004 list so a lot of newer films are not in it. If you then look on the i3a list, it will identify what film the two number parts correspond to. It also works with the film edge code [the little bars] as they correspond to the same thing.

Unfortunately the list is no longer on the i3a's website (which appears to have gone as you're now directed to a project about standardising camera phone quality), but I have a copy of it that I saved before it went. I would attach it, but PDF files can't be attached on here.

The advantage of this system is that you can identify with near certainty what the film is as otherwise the wrong profile etc would be applied during scanning/printing by the processing machinery, which would likely screw up the image quality. I've taken the numbers off 4 Vista 200+ rolls and all of them correspond to Fuji C200 (which makes sense as its marked as made in Japan and Fuji is the last Japanese film company left), and both codes I've been told for the 400+ correspond to Superia 400. I seriously doubt that the 200 and 400 are the same because as I mentioned, there are no real 'cheap' 400 speed emulsions, they have different DX numbers and the image quality would probably suffer greatly if it was 200 re-labelled as 400. The only reason for Ilford uprating HP3 and FP3 in ~1968 was because the 1 stop 'safety factor' was removed from the ASA/ISO specification due to improvements in metering - all of the other film companies followed suit with Kodak also rating Tri-X as 400 rather than its original 200.

Remember that 'Agfa' is not actually 'Agfa' any-more - any Agfa films are just re-branded films from other manufacturers as Agfa-Photo don't make any film so the Vista+ emulsions are nothing like the old proper Vista ones which were exclusively Agfa's. (To avoid confusion, 'Agfa-Geveant' is another company that makes aerial and industrial films - it was spun off from its parent company shortly before Agfa went down in 2006 - many of which are rebranded as Rollei films amongst others)
 
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tikkathreebarrel
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#55
The first one - same as the one I found before online so its definitely Superia 400. To be honest theres only really Fuji Superia 400 and Kodak Ultra 400 in the 400 speed consumer market these days so it would have been one of the two. The DXn number corresponds to the latest version of Superia 400 (as of 2009 when the i3a list was last published) so it is very likely exactly the same stuff as Fuji is selling currently.



Superia 400 was not bad grain wise the last time I used it, but by default mini-labs do apply light grain reduction automatically to any films of 400 and above so that may be part of the reason. I'll compare some similar past Superia 400 shots with some C200/Vista 200+ ones tomorrow, but I think the Superia will probably be way better as C200 is based on a very old emulsion (apparently dating from the late 80's to early 90's) and film technology has improved immeasurably since then - I wouldn't be surprised if todays modern 400 speed emulsions looked better than past 100 speed ones. Its exactly the same with Kodak and their "Colour Plus 200" which is the exact same as VR200 (based on the DXn number) which was released originally in ~1986 (assuming its the improved version over the 1982 original).
Well, I've thrown test film 1 into Boots and should be available for collection on Tuesday 27/5/14: I'll report back.
 

excalibur2

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#56
Just read on another forum that the managers in six Poundland shops have said "they wont be getting any more Vista"...........so if true, does that mean something else or no more film. Doesn't surprise me as with rising cost and maybe it's slow to shift even if they got 30p per film profit...it's not worth the hassle.
Remember the saying make money by "pile em high and flog em cheap".
 
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#57
Can you blame them? Outside of the UK users of a few flickr groups, APUG and TP, it's hardly a massive market for fresh film out there.
 

excalibur2

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#58
Can you blame them? Outside of the UK users of a few flickr groups, APUG and TP, it's hardly a massive market for fresh film out there.
Well I thought there was a small revival using film, and don't forget the groups you mentioned could be enough for 500 (or less as some don't stock film) Poundland shops..... so either they are selling less film than say 3 years ago OR the profit margin is too small.
 

excalibur2

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#60
Looks like I should go and get another 20 tomorrow then! The one I was in today had a massive pile of the stuff!
me too for the future.....mind you my wife is complaining a whole compartment in the freezer is full of film, but I say to her "most of the film if bought new today would cost over £200 so it's worth keeping"
 

Mr Bump

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#61
Some folk making a killing on ebay selling packs of this.

£17.99p for 5 packs free delivery and he has sold 52 packs.
 

excalibur2

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#62
Bought 20 rolls of 200 this morning but no 400 and not many rolls left. Anyway had a word with the manager and asked him to order some 400..well he said "I'll order some specially for you" h'mm well he told me what I wanted to hear whether true or not :kiss:
But when you think about it, Poundland have put themselves in a strait jacket and have no future as everything has to be £1, so e.g. if they can't make a profit on film they can't put it up by 20p (and we would still buy it at that price)...also with inflation could you buy anything decent in say 20 years time for £1. Well the only way out is to call it Twopoundland shop ;)
 
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#63
Bought 20 rolls of 200 this morning but no 400 and not many rolls left. Anyway had a word with the manager and asked him to order some 400..well he said "I'll order some specially for you" h'mm well he told me what I wanted to hear whether true or not :kiss:
But when you think about it, Poundland have put themselves in a strait jacket and have no future as everything has to be £1, so e.g. if they can't make a profit on film they can't put it up by 20p (and we would still buy it at that price)...also with inflation could you buy anything decent in say 20 years time for £1. Well the only way out is to call it Twopoundland shop ;)
With some things they go for smaller pack sizes to get around this, and the same happened with Vista - originally it was 36exp but now nearly always 24exp. But I know what you mean, that can only go on for so long...
 

Mr Bump

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#64
i suppose it depends on if there is some profit in it, old equipment is paid for, those tin cans must be pence each,

Leeds = no stock according to the wife.
 
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#65
i suppose it depends on if there is some profit in it, old equipment is paid for, those tin cans must be pence each,

Leeds = no stock according to the wife.
Paul, I was in Yorkshire at the weekend, checked the leeds and Wakefield stores no 400 in either and no in the stores who could say whether they were getting any? I am back home in East Anglia now, so will check the three Norwich stores tomorrow!
 
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#67
Paul, if I track some down I am going buy a decent stock, there will be some roll with your name on them!
 

excalibur2

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#68
With some things they go for smaller pack sizes to get around this, and the same happened with Vista - originally it was 36exp but now nearly always 24exp. But I know what you mean, that can only go on for so long...
Well anything from China could probably stay cheap for a while, which reminds me of a post (yeah I know you can't believe everything on the net) that the process, machinery etc for lucky color film was set up by Ferrania, well can't Fuji or Kodak do the same...but I suppose it could be selfish in wanting cheap film at the expense of American and Japanese jobs.
 
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#70
Yep! i was even very lucky to grab a pack of 10 that hadn't been opened and the cashier put it through as £1 lol

I've not shot film in awhile as mojo is divorcing me but for a quid you can't go far wrong and it converts to B&W really well
you jammy dodger you :D
 
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#73
theyre really good. It doesnt look like its doing weird things to reds like the 200 does. Unless thats just my wonky exposures :) But it looks a step up in quality anyway.
 
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#74
First film back from Boots standard processing to cd so no fancy tricks but I had to check the negs to be sure it really is ASA 400.
Oh yes, picked some more up today and maybe get some more tomorrow off the back of the first results.
http://s303.photobucket.com/user/tikkathreebarrels/library/Film camera tests/OM something Agfa Vista 400 first test film
These look really good and a very much as I remember Fuji Superior 400. I am having no luck in finding some though! Tried both of the Norwich City Centre stores and none to be seen. Also there was far less 200 than I had seen in the past. None of the staff were able to answer my technical question about whether they would be getting any 400 ISO film?
 

excalibur2

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#75
Grain looks good......when I can get some Vista 400, I'll compare it with Superia 400 I have in the freezer.
 
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#76
Although this is obviously post-processing and camera/lens dependent, those shots do look a lot like some of the Superia 400 I have shot in the past.
 
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#77
First film back from Boots standard processing to cd so no fancy tricks but I had to check the negs to be sure it really is ASA 400.
Oh yes, picked some more up today and maybe get some more tomorrow off the back of the first results.
http://s303.photobucket.com/user/tikkathreebarrels/library/Film camera tests/OM something Agfa Vista 400 first test film
Could you put up a picture/scan of the edge bars (the little bars between the perforations of the negatives) of a couple of the frames? Those will confirm for definite what it really is as they act like the DXn code on the cartridge to allow the film type to be identified when having prints made from the negs. It does look like I remember Superia 400 looking though.
 
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#79
Well having tried Poundland stores in Leeds, Wakefield and Norwich all to no avail in the hunt for 400, I have this evening written to Poundland Head Office to see if I can get some information on availability of this film. I will lel you all know what response I get?
 
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Mr Bump

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#80
Well having tried Poundland stores in Leeds, Wakefield and Norwich all to no avail in the hunt for 400, I have this evening written to Poundland Head Office to see if I can get some information on availability of this film. I will ley you all know what response I get?
im in Hudds on Sat if I fins ome i will clear them out
 
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