Bet the use of this upsets some

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12,196
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Keith
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I used to use the histogram on cameras a lot, but lately I've dropped it, it's just in the way tbh. I trust my eyes, I know with RAW files on modern cameras I've got plenty of leeway
 
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Phil
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SFTPhotography
said
your admission about not knowing about histograms - and by extension that will mean curves/levels does vex me.


Hmmmmm did I say, I don't know about histograms, show me, I thought I said I don't use them

Also get YOUR facts right many including your post has nothing to do with MY original post, others started the mine is better than yours just as you have, perhaps you should stick to my original post as should others.

I bought this new, yes when it first came out and STILL use it today, I use it when using a 10 stopper, saves constantly removing and attaching it to meter.

I use both incident and reflective metering depending on what I am imaging, I bet there are photographers today who don't even know what it is, I bought it from the Camera shop in Aldershot in 1973, I could not afford it all at once and paid 10s a week that is 10 shillings, last year I bought a mint Euromaster 2
I also use incident and reflective meter ‘as appropriate’, I’m also prone to being blunt.
But the only time I give advice on shooting methods is to people struggling to achieve something. And I’ve never been arrogant enough to tell someone who’s been shooting 30 plus years that they’re doing it wrong or they’re not a photographer.

There are many talented photographers on this site pro and amateur, you’re the first person that’s ever joined who considered their opinions superior to everyone else.

It’s already clear you’re less than honest in your posts, how about cleaning up your act and becoming a useful addition to the community.

And learn to use the quote buttons, it’s difficult to read some of your stuff properly.
 
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23,192
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Phil
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Also get YOUR facts right many including your post has nothing to do with MY original post, others started the mine is better than yours just as you have, perhaps you should stick to my original post as should others.
Maybe forums aren't the place for you, you don't get to control how others respond to your posts, or whether they go off topic in interesting ways, we won't all agree that you're the smartest one here - particularly those of us who have similar experience levels and are smart enough to realise there's no single 'right answer'. No one has responded to one of your posts in a 'mine is better than yours' manner - despite the fact you have done so consistently.

But more importantly - you can't expect to be rude to others and for them to consistently cut you some slack, I'm afraid this is a world full of the same people that you'd avoid in real life, but worse because people tend to be nicer in real life than they are on line. That said - the only aggressive posts in any of your threads have been posted by you.
 
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Lloyd
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I'm a fan of ETTR and the use of blinkies as they tell me where something is blown, histograms only tell me that something somewhere is blown, and often the blown area doesn't matter so just knowing there is one isn't of use; that's why I don't use them - quite why the OP doesn't I suspect we'll never know

Oh and I doubt you'll see any photos soon either :D

And maybe I'm wrong, but in your lovely night-time shots Steve, how would a handheld meter work for those from 400 yards away? Its not like someone could run all over the village and mountain phoning back meter readings is it? Or could they if they had a fit assistant ??? :D

Dave
Use a spot meter. Much cheaper and more available than a fit assistant.
 
OP
OP
CanNik
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82
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I asked you to show me where I said I don't know about histograms, I am STILL waiting

Do me a favor ST Photography show me where I said

your admission about not knowing about histograms
 
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Dave
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I asked you to show me where I said I don't know about histograms, I am STILL waiting

Do me a favor ST Photography show me where I said

your admission about not knowing about histograms
I'm pretty sure at least TWO people have already done that - you're just not paying attention bud :)

I've posted this just before you get ranted at lol

Dave
 

TheBigYin

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Mark
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post 147 and post 149, 2 different people have already pointed out where you've said it.

No thanks, I have shot everything from weddings to sports and my customers from individuals to magazines and publications are happy without my knowing
That Certainly reads to me as "no, i'm not going to bother reading up on it, my customers are happy employing me without my knowing about it." - ie, a tacit admission of lack of knowledge.

Apologise to everyone and move on. And that's me speaking with my staff members hat on, not just as a normal forum member.
 
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6,273
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Bazza
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My old Voitlander Vito CL has a light meter built in, All you had to do is get the needle into the centre circle of the other one and job done



and it still works after 53 years
 
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Dave
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post 147 and post 149, 2 different people have already pointed out where you've said it.



That Certainly reads to me as "no, i'm not going to bother reading up on it, my customers are happy employing me without my knowing about it." - ie, a tacit admission of lack of knowledge.

Apologise to everyone and move on. And that's me speaking with my staff members hat on, not just as a normal forum member.

3 people now :D

AND the threat of a 'slap' too !!!

Dave
 
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Rich
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Called this bloke early on, was always going to end up like this.
All that I don't care lark sets the alarm bells ringing, very much like our old mate who regularly trashed his gear.

Possible sock puppet alert?
 
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TheBigYin

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Mark
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Called this bloke early on, was always going to end up like this.
Not Helpful


All that I don't care lark sets the alarm bells ringing, very much like our old mate who regularly trashed his gear.

Possible sock puppet alert?
Definitely not. Do you seriously think we don't have a watch out for that particular person.
 
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Rich
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Not Helpful




Definitely not. Do you seriously think we don't have a watch out for that particular person.
Never thought about it seriously or otherwise.
Does surprise me though that ranty herberts don't get sussed out a bit more pronto
This geezer was obviously not 100%.,
 
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TheBigYin

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Mark
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Never thought about it seriously or otherwise.
Does surprise me though that ranty herberts don't get sussed out a bit more pronto
maybe, just maybe as staff members we're not quite as judgemental as some of the less balanced members... plus, there's basically 3 or 4 of us to keep track of the entire forum and if someone's ranting in (say) the feathered section or cars - i'm never going to see it unless it's reported, because the photo's in there don't interest me in the slightest. Also, we don't just arbitarily throw someone out without there being a consensus between the staff members and it being discussed.
 
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Rich
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maybe, just maybe as staff members we're not quite as judgemental as some of the less balanced members... plus, there's basically 3 or 4 of us to keep track of the entire forum and if someone's ranting in (say) the feathered section or cars - i'm never going to see it unless it's reported, because the photo's in there don't interest me in the slightest. Also, we don't just arbitarily throw someone out without there being a consensus between the staff members and it being discussed.
Loons don't upset or offend me, its only words on a forum and maybe its better than having them shouting in the street.
 
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Lee
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Phil V said:
I think you mean it makes it easier for the way you shoot - OTOH I kinda agree with Bob, I can shoot consistently much quicker in A mode and having compared my Raw's to a few M shooters I'm very confident that my way works better (not just for me)

I don't want to let the camera tell me what to do I DECIDE on DOF, shutter etc, perhaps that is the difference between a photographer and a shutter release presser

.
So when you find a nice landscape scene, how do you decide what aperture, iso and shutter to use? Can you set all three without checking anything and get a perfect image? Or do you use your light meter and transfer those settings to the camera?
We might go out for sunset tonight. I'm still interested in how you approach exposing the perfect landscape shot?
 
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Dave
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We might go out for sunset tonight. I'm still interested in how you approach exposing the perfect landscape shot?
Soz bud but I can't see who that's aimed at or what you're really asking :(

Could be me having a blonde (ok grey/white) moment

Dave
 
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Lee
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Soz bud but I can't see who that's aimed at or what you're really asking :(

Could be me having a blonde (ok grey/white) moment

Dave
It's aimed at the person I quoted....

He decides what to set the camera at, without the camera doing it. I'm just interested where he pulls that information from to know what to set the variables (f/stop, ss, ISO) at.
 
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Phil
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We might go out for sunset tonight. I'm still interested in how you approach exposing the perfect landscape shot?
I don’t really shoot landscapes (half my point about there being no ‘right’ answer)
But if I did, I’d probably go with a start point of taking a reading off the mid tone of the sky and locking it in.


That’s a tad misleading as I do sometimes shoot sunsets as backgrounds, which I do in M as I need a fixed point to hang the flash exposure on. Again though ... all part of understanding when automation is helpful and where it isn’t. BTW I’d be happy to allow the flash to ETTL even though I’ve metered the sky very carefully for the shot I want.

But frankly I can guess the flash power pretty accurately;)
 
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Graham
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It's aimed at the person I quoted....

He decides what to set the camera at, without the camera doing it. I'm just interested where he pulls that information from to know what to set the variables (f/stop, ss, ISO) at.
If you are just wanting a run through of the mechanics, I can help with that.

If you go back to the very first post of this thread, the OP posted a pic of a Weston hand held meter.

At the bottom right you can see the number "100" this is where you set the ISO of the film you are using or the sensitivity you have set in the camera.

You point the meter at the subject (or at the light source if you are using the incident method) and press a small button on the side of the meter. The needle at the top of the picture then moves over one of the numbers shown on the scale, which number depends on the amount of light hitting the meter.

You then manually turn the meter dial until a mark on the dial matches the number identified by the pointer. This is the inner set of numbers on the scale the scale that starts at 16 and goes to 9 in the picture, but runs from 1 to 16 if you could see the entire dial.

The two outer dials then represent the aperture + shutter speed options available to give the "correct" exposure for measured light and the iso set on the meter.

So, again, back to the picture, the dial is suggesting 1/60s @ f1, 1/30s @f1.4, 1/15s@f2 etc and depending on the subject matter, you choose one pair of values to transfer to your camera.
 
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Lee
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I don’t really shoot landscapes (half my point about there being no ‘right’ answer)
But if I did, I’d probably go with a start point of taking a reading off the mid tone of the sky and locking it in.


That’s a tad misleading as I do sometimes shoot sunsets as backgrounds, which I do in M as I need a fixed point to hang the flash exposure on. Again though ... all part of understanding when automation is helpful and where it isn’t. BTW I’d be happy to allow the flash to ETTL even though I’ve metered the sky very carefully for the shot I want.

But frankly I can guess the flash power pretty accurately;)
D'oh....

Not you either..... :banghead:

CanNik. I don't want to end up a shutter release presser!!
 
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Guys. Don't worry. You aren't thinking along my lines......

I can take a landscape photo with my eyes closed...... Well....

I'm waiting for CanNik to confirm how he selects the relevant settings for his camera as a photographer if using the camera and some of its automated features is 'wrong'....
 
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Lee
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If you are just wanting a run through of the mechanics, I can help with that.

If you go back to the very first post of this thread, the OP posted a pic of a Weston hand held meter.

At the bottom right you can see the number "100" this is where you set the ISO of the film you are using or the sensitivity you have set in the camera.

You point the meter at the subject (or at the light source if you are using the incident method) and press a small button on the side of the meter. The needle at the top of the picture then moves over one of the numbers shown on the scale, which number depends on the amount of light hitting the meter.

You then manually turn the meter dial until a mark on the dial matches the number identified by the pointer. This is the inner set of numbers on the scale the scale that starts at 16 and goes to 9 in the picture, but runs from 1 to 16 if you could see the entire dial.

The two outer dials then represent the aperture + shutter speed options available to give the "correct" exposure for measured light and the iso set on the meter.

So, again, back to the picture, the dial is suggesting 1/60s @ f1, 1/30s @f1.4, 1/15s@f2 etc and depending on the subject matter, you choose one pair of values to transfer to your camera.
Informative. Thanks.

So much like composing the shot, setting ISO 100, setting f/8, and the cameras meter giving you the shutter speed? All directly on the camera itself? Then obviously adding a 3 stop filter and changing to f/11 to get the exact shutter speed you want because the scene is too bright....
 
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Graham
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Informative. Thanks.

So much like composing the shot, setting ISO 100, setting f/8, and the cameras meter giving you the shutter speed? All directly on the camera itself? Then obviously adding a 3 stop filter and changing to f/11 to get the exact shutter speed you want because the scene is too bright....
Essentially, yes, but its a bit more complicated than that, there are situations when a hand held meter, especially a spot meter or incident meter can be a bit more convenient, slightly more reliable and consistent way of metering e.g incident metering works particularly well in a studio situation. Sekonic spot meters can be calibrated to the raw output of your individual camera, which is more accurate than using the JPEG based histogram display, but doesn't help identfy blown colours.

I personally, rather like scanning a landscape with a spotmeter to get an idea of how the light levels vary across the scene, which helps judge the exposure, but coming from the days of sheet film cameras, I like the "ritual" of taking landscape pictures, and this includes agonising over the exposure a bit.

So, I still think hand held meters have some value, for some limited applications, but for the vast majority of photography I'm not sure it makes much sense any more.
 

simon ess

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I personally, rather like scanning a landscape with a spotmeter to get an idea of how the light levels vary across the scene, which helps judge the exposure, but coming from the days of sheet film cameras, I like the "ritual" of taking landscape pictures, and this includes agonising over the exposure a bit.
I'm guessing you have a working awareness of zones and their impact on the exposure and the final result.

I love my hand held meter. It really helps when using my Rolleicord or Agfa Isolette.

With my DSLR I do sometimes use manual, but only in either difficult situations or if I want to manipulate tonal values. For that I spot meter.

Clearly this is a very personal approach but now that I've shared that I really hope @CanNik can offer insights into his rational for using either handheld meters or for using manual exposure. It would be so great to be inspired by an expert in the field.
 
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Dave
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It's aimed at the person I quoted....

He decides what to set the camera at, without the camera doing it. I'm just interested where he pulls that information from to know what to set the variables (f/stop, ss, ISO) at.
As I read it you quoted @Phil V - which I couldn't understand - no worries :D

So, being the ever helpful soul I am :) My approach to a sunset shot is...

Shoot a test on AP - review - adjust as needed - reshoot and go to t'pub as t'job is done :)

PP the s*** out of it until I'm happy, t'job done :)

Post on Facebook and revel in the glory, or, if it was s*** even after my PP attempts, sulk a bit :(

Dave
 
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Graham
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I'm guessing you have a working awareness of zones and their impact on the exposure and the final result.
Yes, I was a great fan of the Zone System, and the photographic highlight of my twenties was having a "very" brief chat with Ansel Adams about photographing cobble stoned streets in Edinburgh.

It made a tremendous difference with B/W, where, when combined with different development times, and the use of filters, it allowed great control and understanding of creative exposure, but not sure it's much more than "useful to know something about it" with digital. But I still think in terms of zones a lot of the time.

I still have an MPP, and one day I fully intend doing a bit of 'proper' B/W again.
 
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