Canon EOS R Series Cameras

Jwar1976 said:
While I love the look of the R5 & R6, it is the price that will delay me from getting either. At the end of the month I will have enough money to get the M6 MKII, while it isn’t FF, it will do as an entry into Mirrorless with a very reasonable 14fps. Then if I get hooked on Mirrorless and get good enough BIF results on the M6, then I may just save for the R which I hope will get a small price drop in the coming months. That way I will do Wildlife & Macro on the M6, and then things like Photoshoots & landscapes on the R. I have all the EF lenses I need for Photoshoots, Wildlife, Sports, Landscapes. So am thinking that the R could be the way to go for FF Mirrorles, especially as I have plenty of compati batteries from my 7D & 5D MKIII.
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There is nothing wrong with any of the cameras you mention, or that route forward! It's a thing on photo forums where many act as if money is no hurdle. This has nothing to do with skill level and I've always been savvy to this fact, don't let the spenders for sake influence, you seem to have your own path drawn out - Stick with it!! You can always look to the likes of these cameras further down the line. I don't mind admitting I can't afford the likes of these cameras right now, but doesn't mean I'm not interested, or shouldn't be. It's a target, I know they'll drop in price dramatically over the next 2 years and I'll keep an eye on progress [FW updates etc] - Thee's nothing holding me back in what I use right now [Fuji APSC] only my own stubborness
 
Raymond Lin said:
i guess the RP is the entry level...and will there be an APSC version of the R line with RF-S lenses?

Do they even need it if you can get a R5, electronic shutter at 20fps and crop to your heart’s content.
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The point of APS-C is that its cheaper (especially compared to R5).

The 20fps electronic shutter may or may not be with its downsides like rolling shutter which would make it basically useless for action.
Even X-T3 has blackout free electronic shutter at similarly high frame rate but rolling shutter means its not of much use for action. The only bodies I know of that can do it silently without rolling shutter is the A9/ii.

If the R5 manages the same then that'd be truly game changing.
 
Jwar1976 said:
Getting back to topic, it will be interesting to see if the new models live up to the hype in the coming weeks / month. Being a photographer is expensive but addictive
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Aye, I watched the Gordon Laing YT video demonstrate the stabilisation and was not impressed. It was only a brief look, but supposedly 8 stops of stabilisation should have been better imho. My 70-300mm lens has 3-4 stops of lens stabilisation, and that can be very noticeable, and I think he wasn't even using a telephoto lens. :thinking:

I'm interested to see if they have improved their Dynamic Range performance in comparison to the Nikon and Sony sensors. They are claiming 1 stop of DR improvement. Time will tell. ;)
 
redhed17 said:
Not if you use the 120fps EVF by the sounds of it. ;) :LOL:
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The a9 is rated under 500 shots, it has a 120 EVF, I easily got well over 1000 shots on a charge. A7 rated 700, I got double, RP 250, I get 850 and still have battery, so likely 950 - 1000 ;) my experience is that most cipa milc ratings are pointless, Id rather hear from people who use the camera.
 
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redhed17 said:
Aye, I watched the Gordon Laing YT video demonstrate the stabilisation and was not impressed. It was only a brief look, but supposedly 8 stops of stabilisation should have been better imho. My 70-300mm lens has 3-4 stops of lens stabilisation, and that can be very noticeable, and I think he wasn't even using a telephoto lens. :thinking:
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One of the challenges for an IS system is to figure out what is unintentional shake or wobble and what is intentional (eg panning in still, or recomposing or walking about while taking videos), If it gets it wrong you tend to end up with a jittery movement as it fights the operater's movements; a common example is panning during video where the sensors ends up forever playing catchup.

I don't think Gordon's was a very scientific test of the IS. Plus it looks like it wasn't taken during an exposure or video recording but him recording the HDMI output. To me it looks like he's intentionally moving the camera and the IS gets rid of the shakes but treats the swaying as intentional. Other videos have said they successfully got long hand held exposures and correct behaviour during video takes with movement.

edit: new video

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYSuZBJS4-U
 
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Cagey75 said:
There is nothing wrong with any of the cameras you mention, or that route forward! It's a thing on photo forums where many act as if money is no hurdle. This has nothing to do with skill level and I've always been savvy to this fact, don't let the spenders for sake influence, you seem to have your own path drawn out - Stick with it!! You can always look to the likes of these cameras further down the line. I don't mind admitting I can't afford the likes of these cameras right now, but doesn't mean I'm not interested, or shouldn't be. It's a target, I know they'll drop in price dramatically over the next 2 years and I'll keep an eye on progress [FW updates etc] - Thee's nothing holding me back in what I use right now [Fuji APSC] only my own stubborness
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Completely agree with you on the being influenced part. I bought the used 7D back in 2014 when my 450D malfunctioned then when my Father passed in 2016, it was his dream for me to go Full Frame as he used to be a SLR pro years before hand, but couldn’t get to grips with digital. When the inheritance money cleared, I went straight to WEX and bought a used 5D Mark III and has been my pride a joy since, it has taught me the importance of learning to shoot in manual & in return of me progressing, I have had my dreams of getting published not once but multiple times & got me ringside photography at local sports events. Now the time has come where I want to visit other places & more countries, so reducing the weight of my kitbag and giving my beloved 5D a break after extremely heavy use is a essential thing for me.

What I guess I am basically saying is that I am happy with my lenses & current bodies, but to prolong the life of those bodies that hold so much sentimental value to me, I will be getting a backup APS-C & FF, so it does make sense to start using mirrorless as no doubt if we agree with it or not, it is the future with most lens manufacturers concentrating on the mirrorless marke. Even when I have money, I don’t spur buy, I do research, come onto here and other forums, ask advice, read reviews, look at videos on the products I am interested in.
 
jonneymendoza said:
I dunno. If it works, why bother creating new native lenses if the old ef ones work? Why not just update the ef lenses then?

There has got to be better performance in native lenses vs ef adapted
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The native lenses have a larger throat, one of the consequences is to help with the IBIS.

EF lenses work just as well on R cameras as they did in EF cameras, but RF lenses work better. It’s perfectly logical.
 
Phil V said:
The native lenses have a larger throat, one of the consequences is to help with the IBIS.

EF lenses work just as well on R cameras as they did in EF cameras, but RF lenses work better. It’s perfectly logical.
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Which Is my point. Native works better
 
Sometimes I do wonder, are we forgetting how to just head out, find a nice composition, and click? When did MP count, hyper speedy AF and 4K video become factors in photography?
 
Cagey75 said:
Sometimes I do wonder, are we forgetting how to just head out, find a nice composition, and click? When did MP count, hyper speedy AF and 4K video become factors in photography?
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For me? MP count ceased to be a thing years ago (I’d rather have 20mp than 40), 4K video is a ‘nice to have’ as TVs have got bigger, I rarely shoot video - but when I do it should be as high quality as my TV otherwise why bother?

But the fastest and most accurate AF is fundamental to me. If I’m not focussing the camera myself, I want the machine that’s doing it to be better than me, otherwise what’s the point of it? My first goes with an AF camera (which doesn’t feel that long ago) were an exercise in frustration as it wasn’t as quick as me and would too often pick the wrong target. Eye AF should be the best thing for me since digital.
 
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Phil V said:
For me? MP count ceased to be a thing years ago (I’d rather have 20mp than 40), 4K video is a ‘nice to have’ as TVs have got bigger, I rarely shoot video - but when I do it should be as high quality as my TV otherwise why bother?

But the fastest and most accurate AF is fundamental to me. If I’m not focussing the camera myself, I want the machine that’s doing it to be better than me, otherwise what’s the point of it? My first goes with an AF camera (which doesn’t feel that long ago) were an exercise in frustration as it wasn’t as quick as me and would too often pick the wrong target. Eye AF should be the best thing for me since digital.
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jonneymendoza said:
Af is very important for many photographers
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Well said both of you, admittedly I used to be one of those that thought that the MP was all the bells and whistles of photograph, to the point that even before I got a camera that I was buying dreaded mobile phones purely for their high MP camera.. but since I have progressed in photography getting the sharpest image with decent focusing has been the essential thing. When doing Photoshoots I always try to make sure that the models eyes are not soft, as when zoomed in, softness or oof is not acceptable to me. Also when doing ringside photography for local wrestling events, I try to get a good a focus as possible so that the expressions on their faces when getting pounced on, are clear and not a blur.

I am in mo way a perfectly photographer as I am learning all the time and always trying to better myself. Now that I am getting more into action shots, I appreciate how essential AF is & while the higher MP can come in handy when cropping to zoom in on wildlife, the 20mp Canon 1DX MKII has proven itself as a fantastic body that can freeze and capture action beautifully, so with that in mind, the R6 looks set to be a gem in the making and I cannot wait to hear more about it once reviewers like Dustin Abbott, get their hands on it and post real life in depth findings, as well as any of the community on here that are lucky enough to be one of the early owners.
 
Jwar1976 said:
Well said both of you, admittedly I used to be one of those that thought that the MP was all the bells and whistles of photograph, to the point that even before I got a camera that I was buying dreaded mobile phones purely for their high MP camera.. but since I have progressed in photography getting the sharpest image with decent focusing has been the essential thing. When doing Photoshoots I always try to make sure that the models eyes are not soft, as when zoomed in, softness or oof is not acceptable to me. Also when doing ringside photography for local wrestling events, I try to get a good a focus as possible so that the expressions on their faces when getting pounced on, are clear and not a blur.

I am in mo way a perfectly photographer as I am learning all the time and always trying to better myself. Now that I am getting more into action shots, I appreciate how essential AF is & while the higher MP can come in handy when cropping to zoom in on wildlife, the 20mp Canon 1DX MKII has proven itself as a fantastic body that can freeze and capture action beautifully, so with that in mind, the R6 looks set to be a gem in the making and I cannot wait to hear more about it once reviewers like Dustin Abbott, get their hands on it and post real life in depth findings, as well as any of the community on here that are lucky enough to be one of the early owners.
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I have said ever since the 5d2/5d3 days that af is very very important for basically everyone unless your purposely trying to create out of focus shots.

Out of focus shots will make or break a photo and the client will no doubt tell as well!
 
For most jobs 20mp is fine, I would prefer 25mp since ever since I moved onto FF in the 5D, I have had 23mp as the minimum. For landscapes or commercial work I think 40mp+ would be useful since I would be in more the F4-F11 range and it would be in print etc, just on the safe side, you can still get do it with 25mp, just like to have the option. Although….being Canon, the R5 probably has mRAW format too and lower the pixel count.
 
Raymond Lin said:
For most jobs 20mp is fine, I would prefer 25mp since ever since I moved onto FF in the 5D, I have had 23mp as the minimum. For landscapes or commercial work I think 40mp+ would be useful since I would be in more the F4-F11 range and it would be in print etc, just on the safe side, you can still get do it with 25mp, just like to have the option. Although….being Canon, the R5 probably has mRAW format too and lower the pixel count.
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Doesn't it depend on entirely how large you want to print when it comes to megapixels. Being a Landscape Photographer composition and crop should all be done in Camera really. If you're having to crop heavily in post it means you didn't get the composition right in the field. I'm sure there are plenty of award winning 20mp Canon 6D images out there which can be printed A3+
 
smr said:
Doesn't it depend on entirely how large you want to print when it comes to megapixels. Being a Landscape Photographer composition and crop should all be done in Camera really. If you're having to crop heavily in post it means you didn't get the composition right in the field. I'm sure there are plenty of award winning 20mp Canon 6D images out there which can be printed A3+
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It does depend on how large you want to print, hence for Weddings, 75% of the time people don't print, 24% gets the albums and a 25mp is more than suffice for that.

For Commerical work, where it can go into Magazine, or printed for posters for Shows, you want higher. For Landscape (a hobby), I want larger mp because for cityscape I want to be able to see all the detail, all the life and people in the distance, in every window etc.
 
@Cagey75

www.dpreview.com

Hands-on with Canon's new RF 85mm F2 Macro IS STM

Alongside a trio of telephoto lenses, Canon also announced a new 85mm this week. The RF 85mm F2 Macro IS STM is a compact, affordable alternative to the pro-oriented 85mm F1.2L.
www.dpreview.com www.dpreview.com

Canon_RF_85mm_F2_Macro_004.jpeg
 
twist said:
45MP and eye AF for pretty much anything with an eye, its going to be a very impressive wildlife camera.
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Birds, turtle, the way it knows the neck and where the eyes are, it's all the same shade of dark. Fish too, it's long with no legs, it knows the head and tail (contrast on the dark of the eye no doubt), it's hugely impressive AI programming. If I weren't saving for a house I would get one to dib my toes in.
 
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Raymond Lin said:
Birds, turtle, the way it knows the neck and where the yes are, it's all the same shade of dark. Fish too, it's long with no legs, it knows the head and tail (contrast on the dark of the eye no doubt), it's hugely impressive AI programming. If I weren't saving for a house I would get one to dib my toes in.
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Wonder if the R6 will be as impressive, thats way less money and also looks great.
 
twist said:
Wonder if the R6 will be as impressive, thats way less money and also looks great.
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I would expect so, I only known them to do 1 version of their Dual Pixel AF on their cameras. Let's hope they don't go back to their old ways and gimp it.
 
Raymond Lin said:
I would expect so, I only known them to do 1 version of their Dual Pixel AF on their cameras. Let's hope they don't go back to their old ways and gimp it.
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Looks the same on paper, in fact the R6 focuses to -6.5EV, and an extra stop native ISO.


Camera Feature
Canon EOS R5​
Canon EOS R6​
Sensor Resolution45.0 MP20.1 MP
Low-Pass FilterYes, High-Resolution OLPFYes
Sensor TypeCMOSCMOS
In-Body Image StabilizationYes, 5-axisYes, 5-axis
Sensor Size36.0 x 24.0mm36.0 x 24.0mm
Image Size8192 x 54645472 x 3648
Pixel Pitch4.40 µm6.56 µm
Image ProcessorDIGIC XDIGIC X
ViewfinderElectronic / EVFElectronic / EVF
Viewfinder Type / ResolutionOLED / 5.76 Million DotsOLED / 3.69 Million Dots
Viewfinder Coverage100%100%
Viewfinder Magnification0.76x0.76x
Built-in FlashNoNo
Flash Sync Speed1/2001/200
Storage Media1x CFexpress / 1x SD UHS II2x SD UHS II
Continuous Shooting Speed M / E12 FPS / 20 FPS12 FPS / 20 FPS
Buffer Capacity (RAW)87 (SD UHS II), 180 (CFexpress)240 (SD UHS II)
Max Shutter Speed1/80001/8000
Electronic Front-Curtain ShutterYesYes
Exposure Metering Sensor384-Zone Metering384-Zone Metering
Base ISOISO 100ISO 100
Native ISO SensitivityISO 100-51,200ISO 100-102,400
Autofocus SystemHybrid PDAFHybrid PDAF
Focus Points10531053
Low-Light Sensitivity-6 to 20 EV-6.5 to 20 EV
Internal Video ModesH.264 4:2:0 8-Bit, H.265 4:2:2 10-BitH.264 4:2:0 8-Bit, H.265 4:2:2 10-Bit
Video Maximum Resolution8K DCI @ up to 30p, 4K DCI @ up to 120p4K UHD @ up to 60p, 1080p @ up to 120p
4K Video TypeFull-sensor width (oversampled)1.07x Crop
HDMI Out / C-LOG4:2:2 10-bit HDMI Output / Yes4:2:2 10-bit HDMI Output / Yes
Articulating LCDYesYes
TouchscreenYesYes
LCD Size3.2″ Diagonal LCD3.0″ Diagonal LCD
LCD Resolution2,100,000 dots1,620,000 dots
Built-in GPSNoNo
Wi-Fi / Band802.11a/ac/b/g/n / 2.4 GHz and 5 Ghz802.11b/g/n / 2.4 GHz
BluetoothYes, 5.0Yes, 4.2
BatteryCanon LP-E6NH/LP-E6N/LP-E6Canon LP-E6NH/LP-E6N/LP-E6
Battery Life (CIPA)320 shots360 shots
Weather Sealed BodyYesYes
USB VersionType-C 3.1 Gen 2Type-C 3.1 Gen 2
Weight (Camera Body Only)1.43 lbs. / 650g (body only)1.3 lbs. / 598g (body only)
Dimensions5.45 x 3.84 x 3.46 in. / 138 x 97.5 x 88.0mm5.45 x 3.84 x 3.48 in. / 138 x 97.5 x 88.4mm
MSRP$3,899 (check price)$2,499 (check price)
 
Interesting choice of gimping the Wifi and Bluetooth speed, don't bother me, guess it'll be fast enough for the file size.
 
Raymond Lin said:
Birds, turtle, the way it knows the neck and where the eyes are, it's all the same shade of dark. Fish too, it's long with no legs, it knows the head and tail (contrast on the dark of the eye no doubt), it's hugely impressive AI programming. If I weren't saving for a house I would get one to dib my toes in.
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Looks like theyve also added body and head detect. So as you thought, programmed to recognise different parts of people/animals body. Seen here...

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wf9VqQW0zqI
 
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It’s good that Canon has taken a leaf out of Sony’s playbook and decided to adjust it and gimp things on the areas that doesn’t affect performance, and what is put in is still very good.

Lower pixels on the EVF and LCD, fine.
No CF Express, probably a blessing and not needed
Wifi, Bluetooth, nom 5Ghz and not 5.0. Don’t affect capturing
4k is slightly cropped, but 1.07x is not end of the world.

The AF is there, the colour science is there, the lenses are mostly there.

R6 is would I would get for weddings if I were to go back to Canon.
 
Raymond Lin said:
It’s good that Canon has taken a leaf out of Sony’s playbook and decided to adjust it and gimp things on the areas that doesn’t affect performance, and what is put in is still very good.

Lower pixels on the EVF and LCD, fine.
No CF Express, probably a blessing and not needed
Wifi, Bluetooth, nom 5Ghz and not 5.0. Don’t affect capturing
4k is slightly cropped, but 1.07x is not end of the world.

The AF is there, the colour science is there, the lenses are mostly there.

R6 is would I would get for weddings if I were to go back to Canon.
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I think theyve realised they cant play that game anymore, just like Sony when they released the mk3, Canon looks to have thrown the kitchen sink at it and they will regain market share they lost.

Its still not a low res EVF or LCD
Doesnt need CF express as no 8k and lower MP, buffer looks decent
Crop is very minor, still 4K 60 which is great for most applications

Imo, because the lenses are so good adapted its not the end of the world, till the RFs arrive.
 
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twist said:
I think theyve realised they cant play that game anymore, just like Sony when they released the mk3, Canon looks to have thrown the kitchen sink at it and they will regain market share they lost.

Its still not a low res EVF or LCD
Doesnt need CF express as no 8k and lower MP, buffer looks decent
Crop is very minor, still 4K 60 which is great for most applications

Imo, because the lenses are so good adapted its not the end of the world, till the RFs arrive.
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Not low, Lower (compared to the R5)
 
Say it out loud...

The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
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The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.
The grass is not always greener on the other side.

Now breathe.
 
Raymond Lin said:
Say it out loud...

The grass is always greener on the other side.
The grass is always greener on the other side.
The grass is always greener on the other side.
The grass is always greener on the other side.
The grass is always greener on the other side.
The grass is always greener on the other side.
The grass is always greener on the other side.
The grass is always greener on the other side.
The grass is always greener on the other side.
The grass is always greener on the other side.
The grass is always greener on the other side.

Now buy.
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Excellent advice.
 
That's pretty impressive.
Still waiting for dynamic range tests on R5.
If I wasn't such a MP whore I'd be sold on R6 :D
 
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