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I shall look forward to seeing some shots.
Canon FF mirrorless...
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RedRobin
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.... I'm assuming you mean the EF 24-70mm L rather than a RF lens? Or did you mean the apparently awesome RF 28-70mm F/2L?
I have (am selling) my EF 24-70mm F/4L IS and I am finding so far that the EF lenses work so well on the EF-RF Adapter that you can't tell a difference, even when version III Extenders are also mounted on Canon L II telephoto lenses.
I won't be posting any of my EOS R images until I get some worthy of my Flickr page but we all look forward to seeing yours.
Enjoy! No camera is perfect but I am confident you will like it.
Excusing my ignorance, what is a MFT please?
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Got myself the EOS R few days ago - been taking few pics here and there.
It's sort of my spare-spare-spare body on assignments... for certain types of images.
One thing I noticed yesterday - haven't researched this yet - but it looks like my Samyang manual focus lenses are not working with the adapter/camera.
It just didn't want to take pictures - or video.
All my EF lenses work just fine...
Need to read a bit more and see if the totally MF lenses won't work with the EOS R.
So far I am liking the camera - picture quality is great (in my eyes) - the menu has a familiar feel.
OK - the fps is slow, but it works for certain parts of my work (not the action/sports).
AF locks nicely ...
Still - lot to learn and discover about the camera, but I can maybe see why the mirrorless will be the way cameras are going to go.
Will probably take few editions of EOS R bodies before it is 'there' - but pretty decent first array into mirrorless FF from Canon.
(for the moment - I'd still take my friends Sony A9 for a sports event over this...just can't afford to change all my gear from Canon to Sony)
It's sort of my spare-spare-spare body on assignments... for certain types of images.
One thing I noticed yesterday - haven't researched this yet - but it looks like my Samyang manual focus lenses are not working with the adapter/camera.
It just didn't want to take pictures - or video.
All my EF lenses work just fine...
Need to read a bit more and see if the totally MF lenses won't work with the EOS R.
So far I am liking the camera - picture quality is great (in my eyes) - the menu has a familiar feel.
OK - the fps is slow, but it works for certain parts of my work (not the action/sports).
AF locks nicely ...
Still - lot to learn and discover about the camera, but I can maybe see why the mirrorless will be the way cameras are going to go.
Will probably take few editions of EOS R bodies before it is 'there' - but pretty decent first array into mirrorless FF from Canon.
(for the moment - I'd still take my friends Sony A9 for a sports event over this...just can't afford to change all my gear from Canon to Sony)
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Total speculation having never seen let alone used an EOS-R but could it be a release priority setting so camera wanting focus confirmed before firing?
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Could be.. as said, need to delve deeper into the manual and have some proper time learning the camera.
Now it's just been in between assignments to have a little look at this and that...
RedRobin
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.... Also I suggest testing with focus Face+Tracking OFF instead of ON by Canon's default - I found that this interfered with desired my focus points. But I think that Graham's suggestion makes a lot of sense.
The downside of so many options in digital cameras is that there are so many settings and hence the potential to complicate things.
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is there a "release shutter without a lens" setting somewhere
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Very much this. I guess this is how I feel with Fuji. Once you have something you gel with and enjoy using, you are going to get out and use it more often.
OP
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I've been with MFT from almost the beginning and I can't see myself selling up any time soon for several practical and cost reasons.
Not wishing to offend you or anyone else but I never really understand phrases like "didn't gel" or "don't like using them" as to me these things are just cameras and nothing more, it's not a bonding or emotional experience and I have no relationship with them. The only reasons I haven't enjoyed using kit have been operational or results based. Gelling and enjoying a lump of plastic and metal has nothing to do with it as they're not people or dogs, not for me anyway. No offence meant
but whenever I see posts with less tangible reasons for choosing or not choosing I often do a little double take.
RedRobin
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.... Yes :
MENU : orange set : Tab 5 : 'Release shutter w/o lens : Disable/Enable.
There is also 'Release shutter without card' setting in Tab 1 on MENU first red set.
HTH
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I've been with MFT from almost the beginning and I can't see myself selling up any time soon for several practical and cost reasons.
Not wishing to offend you or anyone else but I never really understand phrases like "didn't gel" or "don't like using them" as to me these things are just cameras and nothing more, it's not a bonding or emotional experience and I have no relationship with them. The only reasons I haven't enjoyed using kit have been operational or results based. Gelling and enjoying a lump of plastic and metal has nothing to do with it as they're not people or dogs, not for me anyway. No offence meant
Fair enough Alan, and I take no offence. I think it’s probably got a lot more to do with ergonomics and the user interface, at least as far as I am concerned. I certainly didn’t mention anything about bonding or any sort of emotional experience or relationship with them. That would be a bit weird LOL.
As for cost, I only could do it as the trade in value of my m4/3 gear matched the purchase price of the body and one lens.
Simon.
RedRobin
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Not wishing to offend you or anyone else but I never really understand phrases like "didn't gel" or "don't like using them" as to me these things are just cameras and nothing more, it's not a bonding or emotional experience and I have no relationship with them. The only reasons I haven't enjoyed using kit have been operational or results based. Gelling and enjoying a lump of plastic and metal has nothing to do with it as they're not people or dogs, not for me anyway. No offence meant
.... I'm not in the least bit offended by this - Afterall it's a valid personal point of view and merely different from my own.
However, I do not agree with that point of view and feel the very opposite even if some folks find that 'weird'. Yes, a camera is a tool but as such it is very much an extension of your self expression. If you feel physically comfortable and at one with it, you enjoy it more and you get more out of it - Both in results and personal satisfaction.
I never gelled or bonded with my EOS M5 and I know exactly why and that's why I bought the EOS R to replace it. It's very early days indeed - Images shot but not processed yet - But I feel myself beginning to bond with it and very much with the RF 24-105mm lens mounted!
Perhaps I am 'weird' because I prefer my camera gear and very tactile high performance car much more to many people - Just about every person I don't know.
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no problem at all
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I bought an Olympus EM5 MkII and without the grip and battery pack it was virtually unusable. As it is the buttons are too close together and other bits get in the way. I've disabled most of them which is fine as I only use it for landscapes so I do t need the level of customisation that I do with my 1DX2, 5D4 and D850. Feeling comfortable with a camera is a must as far as I'm concerned.
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Yes, the EF 24-70mm f4 L is the lens that I'm waiting on. It doesn't arrive until Tuesday, and as I'm at work all week and then away at the weekend, I'm not really sure when I'll get a chance to take many pictures let alone any I would be happy to post here
Simon.
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Again, exactly how I feel. I shoot Fuji, I drive a Mini JCW. The smile when I shoot with my Fuji's, I smile when I drive my car. But I am admittedly an emotional person, maybe that's why I moved away from the DSLR anyway.
RedRobin
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Yes, the EF 24-70mm f4 L is the lens that I'm waiting on. It doesn't arrive until Tuesday, and as I'm at work all week and then away at the weekend, I'm not really sure when I'll get a chance to take many pictures let alone any I would be happy to post here
Simon.
.... The EF 24-70mm F/4L IS is a great lens and the only reason I am selling mine is because the RF 24-105mm saves about £200 as the kit offered with the EOS R body. That £200 saved buys me an EF-RF Control Ring Adapter (on pre-order) and I ever decide to upgrade my EOS R body for a future version I can include the standard EF-RF Adapter in my sale. For my kind of photography, bridging the extra gap from 70mm to 105mm is very useful indeed.
The EF 24-70mm F/2.8L has an excellent reputation but apart from costing and weighing a lot more, F/2.8 isn't needed unless you take certain kinds of photos.
Until you have shot with a RF lens you honestly won't know or feel what the differences are and you will still reap the benefits of the EOS R body.
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Technically my FF Canon and Sony setups produce better results than my Fuji setup. I always go for the Fuji setup first though and have to force myself to take one of the others otherwise they'd never get used!
RedRobin
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Another update from me and I hope you guys don't mind my snippets and also that I haven't processed any of my shots to post here, YET :
Currently I have my EOS R mounted on an EF 500mm F/4L II + 2x III on a Gitzo Fluid Head gimbal on a Skimmer base on the sill of an open window at home. This set up, poking through a military camouflage curtain, and overlooking my wildlife garden, enables me to come and go to shoot in comfort. It is currently as dull as dishwater outside although the light is possibly slowly improving and it's still very windy.
As usual I am shooting in Manual-mode with Auto ISO with a 3200 upper limit.
AF actions quickly and smoothly and with less focus hunting than with D-SLR bodies, or so it seems. The EVF viewfinder is, as many people have already reported, extremely comfortable (much better than the EOS M5) and being able to see an exposure lighten or darken is very helpful together with the option of a visible histogram with two display size options. Shooting wildlife I never seem to have time to leave the viewfinder as you have to with a D-SLR to check the histogram and because of that I have tended to ignore its very existence until post-processing.
You have to play around quite a lot with the Menu settings to set the camera up how you most like it and then be prepared to change some as you move onwards and upwards. This is especially so if you also have an EOS D-SLR.
I am finding that what Canon call the 'Quick control dial' (around the Mode button) a bit too recessed which makes it easier to unintentionally action the Multi-Function Bar. But I think, and hope, I'll get used to it even if I have to disable the touch Bar (which can be slow to respond anyway). We'll see < I'm still learning what customisation will suit me best.
As it's windy I decided to test the Drive fps on some moving leafy branches. Because I am now used to the 14fps of my 1DX-2, my expectations of slooow fps rates on the R have been very poor. Furthermore, the handbook states that fps will suffer when shooting Dual Pixel RAW (which is the only option I am interested in selecting) and also suffer in AF SERVO to the extent that it might only be 3 fps. However, all 8 of the moving leaf images I continuously shot were in focus and the 13 which I just shot of a perched Goldfinch moving his head and twisting his body captured enough bird body positions to give me some keepers and one image which, subject to sharpness, I hope to keep. I was unexpectedly and pleasantly surprised by that but I'll see what future scenarios can deliver. All images look particularly clean on the LCD and with fresh natural colours - Bright without being over saturated. I have Picture Style set to Neutral and RAW to its highest quality.
Incidentally the AF Focus Point turns blue instead of green when in AF SERVO - A nice touch < I wondered and was confused why it was sometimes blue! I have my (adjacent to AF-ON) star button customised to toggle ONE SHOT / AF SERVO.
I'll have to wait for my Control Ring Adapter to arrive before I can settle my customised settings so that they match whether I'm shooting on either an EF or RF lens. I have no plans to add another RF lens to my EOS arsenal.
Will I be shooting more with the R than the 1DX-2? < No! I'll shoot with whichever is best for the target.
Will I upgrade my R to a higher-end R when released? < Not if it doesn't have an articulated screen. I have always missed the articulated screen of my 70D.
Will I upgrade my 1DX-2 to a mirrorless EOS equivalent if released? < That depends on several factors and cost might be one of them but I am liking things about mirrorless technology.
Although I am talking about myself in these posts, I hope that readers can find useful information for themselves in them.
Currently I have my EOS R mounted on an EF 500mm F/4L II + 2x III on a Gitzo Fluid Head gimbal on a Skimmer base on the sill of an open window at home. This set up, poking through a military camouflage curtain, and overlooking my wildlife garden, enables me to come and go to shoot in comfort. It is currently as dull as dishwater outside although the light is possibly slowly improving and it's still very windy.
As usual I am shooting in Manual-mode with Auto ISO with a 3200 upper limit.
AF actions quickly and smoothly and with less focus hunting than with D-SLR bodies, or so it seems. The EVF viewfinder is, as many people have already reported, extremely comfortable (much better than the EOS M5) and being able to see an exposure lighten or darken is very helpful together with the option of a visible histogram with two display size options. Shooting wildlife I never seem to have time to leave the viewfinder as you have to with a D-SLR to check the histogram and because of that I have tended to ignore its very existence until post-processing.
You have to play around quite a lot with the Menu settings to set the camera up how you most like it and then be prepared to change some as you move onwards and upwards. This is especially so if you also have an EOS D-SLR.
I am finding that what Canon call the 'Quick control dial' (around the Mode button) a bit too recessed which makes it easier to unintentionally action the Multi-Function Bar. But I think, and hope, I'll get used to it even if I have to disable the touch Bar (which can be slow to respond anyway). We'll see < I'm still learning what customisation will suit me best.
As it's windy I decided to test the Drive fps on some moving leafy branches. Because I am now used to the 14fps of my 1DX-2, my expectations of slooow fps rates on the R have been very poor. Furthermore, the handbook states that fps will suffer when shooting Dual Pixel RAW (which is the only option I am interested in selecting) and also suffer in AF SERVO to the extent that it might only be 3 fps. However, all 8 of the moving leaf images I continuously shot were in focus and the 13 which I just shot of a perched Goldfinch moving his head and twisting his body captured enough bird body positions to give me some keepers and one image which, subject to sharpness, I hope to keep. I was unexpectedly and pleasantly surprised by that but I'll see what future scenarios can deliver. All images look particularly clean on the LCD and with fresh natural colours - Bright without being over saturated. I have Picture Style set to Neutral and RAW to its highest quality.
Incidentally the AF Focus Point turns blue instead of green when in AF SERVO - A nice touch < I wondered and was confused why it was sometimes blue! I have my (adjacent to AF-ON) star button customised to toggle ONE SHOT / AF SERVO.
I'll have to wait for my Control Ring Adapter to arrive before I can settle my customised settings so that they match whether I'm shooting on either an EF or RF lens. I have no plans to add another RF lens to my EOS arsenal.
Will I be shooting more with the R than the 1DX-2? < No! I'll shoot with whichever is best for the target.
Will I upgrade my R to a higher-end R when released? < Not if it doesn't have an articulated screen. I have always missed the articulated screen of my 70D.
Will I upgrade my 1DX-2 to a mirrorless EOS equivalent if released? < That depends on several factors and cost might be one of them but I am liking things about mirrorless technology.
Although I am talking about myself in these posts, I hope that readers can find useful information for themselves in them.
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Quick question, I assume the support for Canon EF lenses via the adapter is basically as good as it would be on a DSLR?
What about other brands? Sigma/Tamron?
What about other brands? Sigma/Tamron?
RedRobin
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.... Currently, Silent mode has limitations. Perhaps a firmware update might be able to change such limitations?
This linked short article by Canon's Rudy Winston explains : [I think the link code is longer than the article!]
https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/portal/us/home/learn/education/topics/article/2018/september/whats-new-silent-shutter-with-the-canon-eos-r-camera/whats-new-silent-shutter-with-the-canon-eos-r-camera/!ut/p/z1/hZDRToNAEEW_xQ_YzADbXfZxCyxgaQgqIPvSbClUoqWNaWr8e6khNjFxnbfJnLn35oKGZ9CjuQx7cx6Oo3mb9kazzbpI_CQNMMMwE1jk-TJUKkippFB_A_jHSAQ9nf3UjxKBbpZnMUfJA4oPT9KJy8X8bwG03b-CRkHzojx-lrOYhdb2rDXoX37VkqJkIgw8V12hGbBoNFMGflPIBUcsVnEhq2iFKXegvgzdB5Tj8f0wFfx4VTy1ww4aY_iWMtERp2c9oegysjWmI8bFBW8p871dCwnC_X-d1PFPI9qB06Esx0_y2q8jj-ri7gtU9Wod/dz/d5/L2dBISEvZ0FBIS9nQSEh/?urile=wcm
ath:/canon_newweb_content/digital_learning/education+and+inspiration/articles/2018/september/whats-new-silent-shutter-with-the-canon-eos-r-camera/whats-new-silent-shutter-with-the-canon-eos-r-camera
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Nice info. Sorry if I've missed it, but could you confirm if there is/isn't blackout in the EVF when shooting continuous with either mechanical or electronic shutter please?
I've seen a vid showing there isn't any blackout, but then read that there is (n)
Considering selling the 5D4 and picking one of these up to have a play...
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With my T2 I can set the camera up in the garden, wait for the birds to land and shoot from an app on my phone....
RedRobin
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.... If by "support" you mean full functionality without issues, then so far in my experience Canon EF lenses perform equally well on the EOS R as they do on a Canon D-SLR. This can only be via an EF-RF adapter of course.
Canon say that some of the more recent EF lenses perform even better when mounted on an EOS R because the electronic communication is two-way and the EOS R body can exploit more advanced technology.
Regarding third-party brands of lenses or adapters being able to offer without any limitations as much as a Canon combo can, is currently unknown but methinks it is probably becoming more and more difficult for third-party producers to match a camera manufacturer's original equipment. Especially when you consider two-way communication and integration between nano components.
For what it's worth, my Kenko 1.4x extender when mounted on my Canon EF 100mm F/2.8L IS Macro and onto the EOS R via Canon's EF-RF Adapter, works and performs equally to how it does on my D-SLR body.
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RedRobin
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.... I can do that as well but not necessarily totally silently if using AF SERVO (continuous fps drive shooting).
I have found that some birds will stop and look towards the sound but not instantly fly away. They are only curious about sound but more spooked by movement.
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RedRobin
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.... Quite honestly I have so far only shot twice any continuous action and was so excited that the frame rate was faster than I had expected that I hardly noticed! Blackout or not I don't think it matters because in those continuous shooting circumstances you don't have either need or any choice to change anything while it's actually happening. Even if silent shooting, what are the real benefits either with or without blackout? Bang-bang-bang = Job done in seconds and check it out afterwards but don't miss any subsequent action while you are checking it out (called 'chimping'?).
What I did notice and quite liked was that when finished and with my eye still in the viewfinder, the last image of the captured set was on display. Although that could be a serious nuisance if shooting bursts with very short pauses in quick succession - I'll have to test that on some local seagulls when the light improves.
EDIT : I think that without blackout you see a glimpse of each shot as it speeds past but as I shoot 14fps as default on my D-SLR (1DX-2) I'm not going to register seeing each shot in the burst so easily anyway. I have never thought about it and don't see the need to - I just check the results later.
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Having no blackout helps immensely when tracking moving objects and shooting continuous, especially when the subject isn't moving in a straight line or is accelerating/decelerating. It's what I love about the A9. Cameras that only show a 'slideshow' of the images called during continous shooting make it a bit harder to track accurately.
I don't think I have ever used high speed continuous shooting on a static object to be honest.
RedRobin
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.... I don't quite understand this. On the D-SLRs I have owned I have never experienced a fast frame rate causing me any 'blind' spots while tracking. Are you saying that a mirrorless camera is able to track better than a D-SLR?
.... "Static" as in a building or stone monument? A perched bird is rarely static and will at the very least move its head while looking and listening. Herons are an exception and I have spent serious time waiting for them to move slightly to present a better shot for me.
I have continuous drive set without changing it and only toggle between ONE-SHOT and SERVO tracking. Even just squeezing off 3 shots of a static subject can offer you one image sharper than the others.
I don't see any reason to go to and fro between drive settings and so I just leave it on what I use the vast majority of the time. There's no right or wrong way though - We each have our own preferred ways of shooting.
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It was common with mirrorless cameras, that at the high FPS rate you wouldn't actually still see a 'live' view in the EVF and would instead see the images captured at the high FPS rate. So for example you would only see a refresh in the EVF of 8 frames per second if shooting at 8 FPS.
Obviously with a DSLR you don't get this, you get the mirror flip blackout but always see the live image through the optical viewfinder.
Shooting with the electronic shutter could get around this, but then you can get the jello effect with fast moving subjects (until the stacked sensor of the A9 that is).
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RedRobin
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.... Thanks for the explanation. All I can do is test tracking tomorrow on some flying seagulls at home, of which there are plenty!
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Robin if the R follows the general trend with mirrorless , you should have a review image section in menu ,set that to zero that will stop the last image being displayed , that’s how it works on MFT anyway
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One of the reasons I moved to MFT earlier this year was the sheer weight of the lenses ,it’s gotten worse as I have got older and my gut feeling was it was taking the fun out of things for me . Since changing I now know that I was correct I am really enjoying photography again , and while I can see that this FF mirrorless is a huge step forward while it’s still tethered to heavy expensive lenses I can’t really see me changing back
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And with a larger mount. We will see larger lenses that are f1 etc. Look at the size of the 24-70 F2... Gigantic lol.
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Panamoz are showing the same deal for £1880 + three year guarantee.
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I stick it into MF, and prefocus.
RedRobin
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.... s***! That's a big reduction - I often buy from them but assumed they wouldn't be selling them for a month or two.
RedRobin
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.... Yes, that's a better way and if using a RF lens you can set the option to read the lens focal distance in the EVF < Pretty cool, eh.
Can't wait to try that - Just need some decent light and not high winds!