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Paulie

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Paul
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I'm a driver for a company, I was informed today of a parking ticket which the company recieved because I parked on a double yellow whilst in a company vehicle on company business. There was no alternative parking area, so the ticket was unavoidable (although I've been stopping here for over a year and never had a ticket).

My manager told me the amount for the ticket will be deducted from my wages. I point blank refused to pay it and said I will seek legal advice if they deduct my wages.

The parking ticket was on 03/07/12 and I only got told today 23/07/12, 20 days later. They have already paid the council, which waives my right to lodge an appeal, which I believe would have been successful.

My contract does state that I'm liable for parking fines, however if they are unavoidable, will that hold any water?

Thanks
 
Define unavoidable. Why were you parked there?
 
What vehicle do you drive and why do you have to park there?
 
I was collecting around 200kgs of books from a shop as part of my job. There was nowhere else to stop.
 
They should provide you with a way to move the 200Kg - pallet truck or similar and you use that, if you then choose to park on double yellow because you don't want to walk that far, then that is your choice and fines would come back to you I believe.
 
In the councils website under appeals, it says to provide any delivery note to prove I was loading. What I really want to know is my company liable for the ticket and can they lawfully deduct my wages?
 
Bang to rights

you shouldnt have been parked on doubles in the first place (and you clearly werent loading as you must have been away from the vehicle or you'd have noticed the warden)

and it says in your contract that you are liable for parking fines

just man up and pay the ticket - and next time don't obstruct the traffic in the first place
 
It wasn't a warden, it was a camera. I wasn't obstructing traffic, I was actually parked behind a huge bin that is permanently in the road which is as wide as my van.
 
And there is no where else to stop, I have to stop there as part of my job. So why should I personally have to pay for any fines if I can not avoid them?
 
refuse the pick up if there is no where to park
 
Paulie said:
And there is no where else to stop, I have to stop there as part of my job. So why should I personally have to pay for any fines if I can not avoid them?
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because you signed a contract saying you would ? - did you not read your contract before you signed it ?

Theres no point in seeking legal advice because any lawyer worth his salt will point out you are completely in the wrong and will lose in court (any lawyer who tells you otherwise is probably thinking of leeching off fees )

(also paying a layer who'll charge about £80 per hour to contest a fine which is probably less than 1 hour of lawyer time, is just daft)

Dale_d3100 said:
refuse the pick up if there is no where to park
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This

or park in the nearest available space and use a sack trolley
 
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actually YOU CAN PARK ON DOUBLE YELLOWS if its a comercial vehicle loading / unloading for upto 10 mins.... thats law

as an ex courier driver i had to use this law on more than a few occasions.... even citing it to traffic wardens ... who on radioing back had it confirmed.....

dont know where this little nugget of info leaves you though
 
My grievance is with my company, not the council. I believe they should pay it, if it were down to me I would appeal it as I'm pretty sure I am allowed to load there. But because they have paid it, I no longer have the option.
 
It was your choice to park on the yellow lines, not theirs. You should pay.
 
andyst2409 said:
actually YOU CAN PARK ON DOUBLE YELLOWS if its a comercial vehicle loading / unloading for upto 10 mins.... thats law
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unless loading is prohibited by line marking like this (not my photo)

dsc00810.JPG


and a valid no loading sign
 
The legality of loading on double yellow lines aside as I know nothing about this. Why specifically do you feel your employer is responsible for the fine despite your contract specifying they're yours to pay?
 
Paulie said:
My grievance is with my company, not the council. I believe they should pay it, if it were down to me I would appeal it as I'm pretty sure I am allowed to load there. But because they have paid it, I no longer have the option.
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bottom line - you arent going to get definitve legal advice on a photo forum. - go see a lawyer (who will probably tell you the same as we have, but do it definitively - and charge you nearly as much as the fine for the priviledge)

Or you could just pay it and be better off in the long run (incidentally if you do contest it with your employer in court, you may pee them off so badly you shortly find yourself without a job - even if you win over the fine that would be the very definition of pyhric victory )
 
So what your saying is that everytime you park there to pick up you want your company to stump up the fine?? So if you got a fine every week you would want them to pay it?

Its your job to find suitable parking places you are in charge of the vehicle. If your company have already paid they must be sure they wouldnt win on appeal.

Companys dont pay out money if they dont have to. As for there is no place to park then if you cant find a place refuse to do the pick up simples.
 
Most companies and leasing companies will pay the fine and reclaim later as this stops the penalty increasing! No employer is legally allowed to make deductions from your wages without prior written consent other than PAYE etc.

Then again you and your employers are not above the law and you chose to park where you did........ tough! You got caught. :)
 
Splog - would not signing a contract accepting you will pay fines cover the taking the money from your wages?
 
I should have been given an opportunity to appeal, and should have been informed before they paid it. Not 20 days later.
 
If it is my fine then surely it's my decision to appeal it, not the company.
 
thought it a fairly standard part of contract law.........

i.e. something akin to "you are liable for any fines incurred when using company vehicle . pool car / hire car" etc... I can find ours tomorrow.... but basically "If you are in charge of the vehicle you are liable for any fine!"

Seems reasonable to me.

Seems you are p****d off you got caught. Man up and pay.
 
Dale_d3100 said:
Splog - would not signing a contract accepting you will pay fines cover the taking the money from your wages?
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Yes, of course it would, however the op should have the right to challenge the ticket even if it has already been paid!
 
even if that were true (which depends on the exact wording of your contract) you can't appeal based on it being unavoidable because the councils point will be, it is avoidable- don't park on double yellows - simples

Saying 'oh but we have too' - will cut no ice at all, because the council doesnt care whether you pick up 200kg of books there or not - they only care about their parking restrictions

You might've been able to appeal on the - the no loading was improperly signed/ i wasnt there for more than 10 minuites basis - but your company obviously doesnt agree.
 
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Paulie said:
If it is my fine then surely it's my decision to appeal it, not the company.
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its not your fine - its a company vehicle so its their fine as registered keeper of that vehicle, so its up to them , not you, whether it is appealed

however your contract states that they can reclaim it from you
 
Paulie said:
I should have been given an opportunity to appeal, and should have been informed before they paid it. Not 20 days later.
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Im not realy sure what you want us to say. Take a good look at your contract if it states your liable and if you get a fine then it comes out of your wages and you put your name on it then thats it.

Not sure how much more any member on here can help you. Like moose said if you want to spend your hard earned on a brief then do that but like he said its going to cost you more than the fines going to cost.

I understand its p**ed you off but looks like your going to have to suck it up and make it plain next time if you cant park your not dropping off or picking up.
 
Ive told them I'll no longer collect from that shop. Their response was "we will pay if you get another one there" so what the difference between this one and the next one? Oh well, I'll just wait and see how it pans out.

Thanks for the responses :)
 
Just refuse or get it in writing from them. If they refuse to put it in writing, refuse to collect.
 
I know this for sure, If you have it in your contract, and if you have had the contract a reasonable time (4 weeks is generally considered reasonable), be it Signed or Unsigned it is deemed accepted - and you will be liable, and they have the right to deduct..

I have had the argument several times over the years with my employees and this was tested out by all sorts of means (employees going to citizens advice, free legal clinics etc)

I have been caught out several times when employees say they will appeal or pay it themselves, unfortunately they tend to forget and the fine often doubles, I do however listen to reason and check with the worker prior to paying the bill and seeing if appeal is warranted - if not gets stopped out of next pay packet, no exception
 
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As I said earlier ... most leasing companies will pay the fine as they are the owners and then bill the company. The fine can still be challenged! I''ve had tho deal with it many times often when the drivers need identifying or the time has lapsed for the issuing of the ticket and also when it's a loading or unloading issue?

The wardens do make mistakes..... occasionally .. lol
 
Can I still challenge after 21 days? Cant find any info regarding timescale on their website, I'll check all the signs tommorrow as I'm in the area. It's Brighton and hove council.
 
Paulie said:
Can I still challenge after 21 days? Cant find any info regarding timescale on their website, I'll check all the signs tommorrow as I'm in the area. It's Brighton and hove council.
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You should have been given the notification .... that will give you all the info you need.
 
I wasn't given it, but I'm sure I can get it tommorrow, thanks for your help.
 
big soft moose said:
unless loading is prohibited by line marking like this (not my photo)

and a valid no loading sign
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What he said.

You haven't actually said if there were any loading restrictions and if you broke them. As has already been stated, parking on double yellows doesn't necessarily mean anything when it comes to loading. (Which a few people in this thread appear ignorant of.)

If the ticket was issued wrongly then it should have been appealed. If your employer has effectively removed this right of appeal from you, I would be telling them they can pay the ticket.

If it's in your contract to pay legitimate tickets, then they should check for legitimacy, or allow you to, before paying. I would be arguing its an unfair clause as-is. But without knowing what exactly your contract says...

It might be enough to get them to waive it as a gesture of 'good will'.

I worked as a courier for several years for a large, national company and they covered the cost of tickets. However, I never got issued any. :-D

For the future though: if there is nowhere to legally park near the collection/drop-off and you have to park far away then this should be taken into account by your employer. They must provide the correct equipment for you to carry the goods between vehicle and 'shop'. Have/will they? Legally parking far away may also add a delay to the visit. Make sure your employer knows this. Put the ball in their court. Make sure they're helping you do your job quickly, safely and legally. (I imagine some smaller companies may fall short in such regards.)
 
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Spoke to a company director today, he agreed that parking where i did was of no benefit to me, and that i should have had the opportunity to appeal the ticket before it was paid. So the company are going to swallow the fine. :)
 
Paulie said:
Spoke to a company director today, he agreed that parking where i did was of no benefit to me, and that i should have had the opportunity to appeal the ticket before it was paid. So the company are going to swallow the fine. :)
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:clap: Fantastic. well done that man
 
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