Suicidal Cyclist

[jamesev]

Roads are centrally funded, have been for a number of years so cyclists pay for the roads as much as you do. As for road tax (or whatever you call it), that's largely based on emissions, there are cars which are exempt. I am also exempt as I have a motability vehicle.

As for deliberately using your washers when overtaking a cyclist, highly dangerous and irresponsible, think you lost any moral highground here.

It’s VED, vehicle emissions duty. Electric cars that produce no emission at source are charged zero for their zero emissions. You know what else doesn’t produce emissions....

There fore contribute the correct duty rate. As for insurance many cyclists do have public liability insurance. If not they risk being fully exposed to damage costs.

 

[nilagin]

I rest my case. Spraying people in the eyes with screen wash; irresponsible and potentially deadly. Perhaps we should warn the cyclists in Lancashire. Or perhaps the police.

He didn't actually say he sprayed it in their eyes and shouldn't you be wearing some sort of safety glasses?

 

[gman]

Roads are centrally funded, have been for a number of years so cyclists pay for the roads as much as you do. As for road tax (or whatever you call it), that's largely based on emissions, there are cars which are exempt. I am also exempt as I have a motability vehicle.

Largely based isn't good enough. Everyone knows using emissions as an excuse is a load of crap by the Government to justify taxing motorists more. The Tesla produces zero emissions but due to the list price you pay £310 tax per year for the first five years.

It’s VED, vehicle emissions duty. Electric cars that produce no emission at source are charged zero for their zero emissions. You know what else doesn’t produce emissions....

Yes, the Tesla and you do pay considerable tax on it.

And it's Vehicle Tax not VED. They've changed it for obvious reasons. A bicycle is a vehicle.

 

[Craigus]

When cyclists have an MOT on their machines

This is not required by law, as I'm sure you are well aware.

take out insurance

As above. Though many cyclists do have insurance (including me) due to the high likelihood of their fairly expensive bikes being damaged by motorists who aren't paying attention or have a blatant disregard for other road users safety.

pay road tax,

There is no such thing.

then they are classed (by me) to have equal share on what I pay for.

You don't pay for it.

Until then, I often find that overtaking them is a good time to check out the washer/wipe system on the BMW...

Do you do the same when you go past a horse?

 

[Marc]

A bicycle is a vehicle

Which produces no emissions so is therefore exempt from tax, what's your point?

 

[Marc]

Everyone knows using emissions as an excuse is a load of crap by the Government to justify taxing motorists more

Yet so many people who drive cars with low emissions are paying less tax, quite a lot less in some cases.

 

[AJQS]

Wow, Road Rage in text form!

 

[Graham W]

When cyclists have an MOT on their machines, take out insurance and pay road tax, then they are classed (by me) to have equal share on what I pay for.
Until then, I often find that overtaking them is a good time to check out the washer/wipe system on the BMW...

That's good, I always scrape my handlebar down the side of BMWs, and kick their indicators...it's not as though they ever get used!

 

[andyred]

Really - this is what the thread has descended to !!!

Words fail me...

 

[gman]

Which produces no emissions so is therefore exempt from tax, what's your point?

Read my earlier post better

 

[gman]

Yet so many people who drive cars with low emissions are paying less tax, quite a lot less in some cases.

Again read my earlier posts better.

 

[jamesev]

Really - this is what the thread has descended to !!!

Words fail me...

Seems to be fairly standard at the moment. Lot of pent up photo rage. Almost as if winter has put the anchors on venting through going out to photo. Should clear up by spring.

 

[Gremlin]

What I didn’t get with that OP was it started with the sun is shining..... if the sun is out why would it be any more difficult to see a cyclist

Sorry should have gone into more detail I suppose

I did say "narrow rural roads" should have added with trees on both sides, sun is low in the sky at this time of year
so you get dappled light, sometimes straight into the front screen.
I take it you don't feel that cyclist should take some share in being seen, same as walkers on the side of the road.
I appreciate that we have been pampered into thinking everyone should wear hiviz, but surely light coloured shorts etc would
be better then the dark stuff that seems to be favoured these days

 

[jamesev]

Sorry should have gone into more detail I suppose

I did say "narrow rural roads" should have added with trees on both sides, sun is low in the sky at this time of year
so you get dappled light, sometimes straight into the front screen.
I take it you don't feel that cyclist should take some share in being seen, same as walkers on the side of the road.
I appreciate that we have been pampered into thinking everyone should wear hiviz, but surely light coloured shorts etc would
be better then the dark stuff that seems to be favoured these days

I think that in this case yes where sun light can mask the visibility of cyclists it would be wise for them to have more viz. but in the middle of summer with the sun overhead and excellent visibility if something the size of a cyclist can be seen then it questions the competence of the driver to be on the road in the first place.

I believe many motorists believe holding a licence and driving is a right not a privilege.

 

[welshwizard645]

Which produces no emissions so is therefore exempt from tax, what's your point?

only when it's static or going downhill, does the cyclist not breathe?

 

[Marc]

Read my earlier post better

Again read my earlier posts better.

No, I read them just fine, that's why I responded to them and why you should respond to mine rather than reading yours "better".

If you feel I have misunderstood you, then take the time to clarify what you're trying to say, don't just tell me to read your posts better, that's just rude.

 

[Marc]

only when it's static or going downhill, does the cyclist not breathe?

I assume that's tongue in cheek but, just in case it's not, those aren't the type of emissions that drive the cost of taxing a vehicle.

 

[Cobra]

The Tesla produces zero emissions but due to the list price you pay £310 tax per year for the first five years.

That really sets a precedent for all these electric cars that at present, pay no VED, doesn't it?
I often wondered if we ever went "full electric" where all that extra revenue ( just under 6 billion ££ ) was going to come from ...

I guess we know.

 

[jamesev]

only when it's static or going downhill, does the cyclist not breathe?

No more than a driver

That really sets a precedent for all these electric cars that at present, pay no VED, doesn't it?
I often wondered if we ever went "full electric" where all that extra revenue ( just under 6 billion ££ ) was going to come from ...

I guess we know.

The government has set itself emissions targets. If transport went full electric and we also met emissions for the generation of the electricity needed then there’s a targets tick. However there is still a duty for cars over 40k rrp. So revenue does still come from some electric vehicles eg Tesla. But it’s suggested that the cost of electric vehicle manufacture will come down significantly in about 5 years. After all an ICE has about 3000 moving parts where as an electric about 50. Also about 5 years out is the range issue. So it won’t be long until the crossover point from ICE to Electric happens.

 

[reheat module]

Ok - let's put this to bed here and now.
jamesev gets the prize for sniffing out the falsehood, by saying BMW drivers don't have tax.
It was a fishing trip and the bait, hook, shot, line, float, reel and rod all went under.
I would never do anything as stupid as to put cyclists in any danger.
I do feel the need to 'fess up though.

I do however, get frustrated when cyclists ride 2 abreast in gangs down lanes.
I don't live in Lancashire.

 

[nilagin]

I assume that's tongue in cheek but, just in case it's not, those aren't the type of emissions that drive the cost of taxing a vehicle.

People exhale CO2. Emissions taxation is based on CO2

 

[nilagin]

No more than a driver



The government has set itself emissions targets. If transport went full electric and we also met emissions for the generation of the electricity needed then there’s a targets tick. However there is still a duty for cars over 40k rrp. So revenue does still come from some electric vehicles eg Tesla. But it’s suggested that the cost of electric vehicle manufacture will come down significantly in about 5 years. After all an ICE has about 3000 moving parts where as an electric about 50. Also about 5 years out is the range issue. So it won’t be long until the crossover point from ICE to Electric happens.

You are likely to breathe heavier and faster whilst cycling than sitting in a car driving to which point a cyclist will produce more CO2 than a driver.

 

[jamesev]

Ok - let's put this to bed here and now.
jamesev gets the prize for sniffing out the falsehood, by saying BMW drivers don't have tax.

That’s not what I said at all. I said you don’t pay road tax as that was abolished in 1937. So not a falsehood.

 

[welshwizard645]

I assume that's tongue in cheek but, just in case it's not, those aren't the type of emissions that drive the cost of taxing a vehicle.

No, that's serious - VED is based on CO2 emissions. everyone exhales Carbon dioxide (not pure Co2, just a higher concentration)

 

[Marc]

People exhale CO2. Emissions taxation is based on CO2

Ok, so how much CO2 does a cyclist exhale in comparison to, say, a Ford Focus ST per mile travelled? I realise that it will vary from person to person and the way the car may be driven but just a rough guesstimate will do.

 

[jamesev]

Ok, so how much CO2 does a cyclist exhale in comparison to, say, a Ford Focus ST per mile travelled? I realise that it will vary from person to person and the way the car may be driven but just a rough guesstimate will do.

It’s minimal. 1kg per day

 

[gman]

No, I read them just fine

Evidentially not, Cobra picked up on what I was saying just fine. No need to make a big deal out of it, I'm on my phone and out and about so I sometimes have to be brief with a reply.

 

[Chipper]

He didn't actually say he sprayed it in their eyes and shouldn't you be wearing some sort of safety glasses?

Of course he didn’t. He wouldn’t care. Nor would he be able to control the direction. Safety glasses because of an aggressive BMW driver? Unbelievable.

 

[Marc]

No, that's serious - VED is based on CO2 emissions. everyone exhales Carbon dioxide (not pure Co2, just a higher concentration)

Fair enough so see my response to Neil

It’s minimal

That's what I'd imagine so pretty much a red herring as far as this particular debate is concerned.

 

[Marc]

Evidentially not, Cobra picked up on what I was saying just fine. No need to make a big deal out of it, I'm on my phone and out and about so I sometimes have to be brief with a reply.

Oh, you must be correct then.

 

[ancient_mariner]

This thread is a useful demonstration that the quantity of 'arse' embedded in a persons character has no correlation with the number of wheels on their chosen form of transport. As you were.

 

[nilagin]

Of course he didn’t. He wouldn’t care. Nor would he be able to control the direction. Safety glasses because of an aggressive BMW driver? Unbelievable.

I wore cycling safety glasses around 15yrs ago when I cycled to work. All my mates that cycle to work or for recreation wear safety glasses and not because of aggressive BMW drivers. Grit, insects, ever heard of them?

 

[F1.2]

Which produces no emissions so is therefore exempt from tax, what's your point?

I cant agree with your comment Marc ,

I bet they fart at some point producing emissions , all that pushing and straining when getting going must produce some bottom burps

 

[nilagin]

After all an ICE has about 3000 moving parts where as an electric about 50.

That must be one seriously big and powerful or a needlessly complicated engine. Even a V8 engine only has just over 200 moving parts.

 

[onomatopoeia]

It’s VED, vehicle emissions duty.

"VED" is Vehicle excise duty, also known as vehicle tax. You made "vehicle emissions duty" up.

 

[onomatopoeia]

That’s not what I said at all. I said you don’t pay road tax as that was abolished in 1937. So not a falsehood.

Vehicle tax was introduced in 1888 and for some time was hypothecated to a road fund that was supplemented from general taxation. It was colloquially known as "road tax" and though the hypothecation was removed befoer WWII, the colloquial name persists and is understood by the vast majority that use the roads, for it is a tax one must pay to keep a vehicle on the roads.

 

[onomatopoeia]

After all an ICE has about 3000 moving parts where as an electric about 50

You have never dismantled and rebuilt an internal combustion engine, have you, because you are talking utter nonesense. Are you making it up or is someone feeding you this stuff?

 

[Chipper]

I wore cycling safety glasses around 15yrs ago when I cycled to work. All my mates that cycle to work or for recreation wear safety glasses and not because of aggressive BMW drivers. Grit, insects, ever heard of them?

Ah, sarcasm. How helpful. interesting you imply that it would be ok to direct washer bottle fluid at a cyclist if he is wearing safety glasses.

 

[nilagin]

Ah, sarcasm. How helpful. interesting you imply that it would be ok to direct washer bottle fluid at a cyclist if he is wearing safety glasses.

I never implied anything. Did he say he would direct his washer spray at a cyclist, or just squirt his washers. Chances are all a cyclist would get is a little bit of overspray, no different to a following car and probably smaller droplets than falling rain.

 

[Chipper]

When cyclists have an MOT on their machines, take out insurance and pay road tax, then they are classed (by me) to have equal share on what I pay for.
Until then, I often find that overtaking them is a good time to check out the washer/wipe system on the BMW...

Yes. Read the last line and then pretend it doesn't mean that.