Disabled photographers society

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Hi All,

Ok, I am in rather a questioning mood tonight, my apologies.

What comes over very strongly to me through this thread is the strength of emotions it raises on both sides, one side being controlled by, perhaps, a dated constitution which limits the role it can play yet clearly valued by many, the other side having developed a service which clearly had an impact on disabled photographers hence the significant increase in membership in the area it served. May I clarify my comment about a dated constitution, I recognise there have been attempts to change it and that some changes have been blocked by the charity commissioners

My question, what lessons can be learnt from this issue and how can photographers with disabilities be better served in the future? Is the idea of say a network of accessible studios potentially a reality, is that what is wanted? Should there be one group that encompasses the current work of the DPS and tries to develop a network of studios or would they remain separate. Are we all missing the point and in fact the views of the majority of photographers with disabilities are not represented by either group and we need to be looking at something entirely different, if so what?


Sorry, lots of thoughts there, no real answers yet, give me your views; let us keep the politics and old arguments out of it from this post onward. May I ask one thing though, if you know of other photographers with disabilities please ask them to contribute to the thread, let us get as many views as possible.

Regards
Chris
 
You know, since I’ve been in this forum I’ve heard from a lot of current DPS members who are watching this thread without participating in it. From what I’ve been told there were a lot of concerns among the membership before all this happened regarding the fact that their money (and it definitely is their money) was being used to fund a facility which as far as they were concerned was totally beyond their access because of the locality. There were apparently a great many who were perplexed by what appeared to be a cloud of mystery surrounding this particular venture
What I think is being missed here is the fact that members of the DPS are disabled, many of them seriously and their only outlet is the joy of their photography. I think the members deserve better treatment . I think they deserve people in authority who do not see one photographic studio in Bristol as the be all and end all of the DPS but who are prepared to examine their needs and spend their money on looking after those needs, not just on the minority who are passionate about a photographic studio.
I think that is what bought about this situation in the first place, and I think the way forward from here is to put things back together in a fair and honest way which is openly accountable to the membership in the same way as any other charity.
I agree the constitution of the DPS is rather old fashioned but if everyone, and I mean everyone, not just the chosen few, pulled together, things could be made much better.
So, the best thing to do is stop all this bickering, and united as a group representing people with disabilities work towards the common good.
After all we live in a world at the moment where the government is falling apart, there is a recession, and it’s hard enough for the disabled to survive. So maybe it’s time to start behaving like grown-ups??
 
Excellent post

I have no affiliation with the DPS but from what I have read, heard and seen as an outsider I think you have pretty much hit the nail on the head Jan.
 
Just a thought.

If regional studios are required, could you approach local studios/photographers with a view to hiring a studio for a day, possibly at a reduced rate to the charity? Depending on funds / support you could make that as regular as required without the overheads of a premises.

Some local photographers/studios may be grateful for the extra income in the current downturn?
 
That is just what I was saying To the wife,and was just going to put up a post with my views on the subject. will put a post up soon.
 
I've been giving some thought to all this, and I've a few ideas of my own, which I intend to 'share' with committee if and when I rejoin the DPS.

There should be regional representatives who are all accountable to the main committee, who should convey the wishes of their local members to the committee. They should also be responsible for organising regional get togethers and events, exhibitions studio days and the like to which all members could be invited. As Byker says a studio could be hired for the day without the need of a huge expenditure.

One area where the DPS has been lacking is communicating with the membership. As I sit here in the Yorkshire Dales I have no idea where the nearest members of the DPS are. Wouldnt it be nice for some of us to be able to get together, hire a minibus (at our own expense not the DPS's) and set off for a day's photoshoot with no need for a studio. Or if I was on holiday in an area I could contact someone from the DPS and find out where locally I could find a disabled friendly area to take photographs, my own interest being wildlife.

Really it would be very simple to setup, a 'contact' page on the website could set the ball rolling, and then the appointment of some regional representatives to co-ordinate things. In the long term these local activities would probably attract many more members

I really hope the DPS manage to sort out this present conflict, and get back on track as they are an extremely worthwhile organisation.
 
Byker28i said:
Just a thought.

If regional studios are required, could you approach local studios/photographers with a view to hiring a studio for a day, possibly at a reduced rate to the charity? Depending on funds / support you could make that as regular as required without the overheads of a premises.

Some local photographers/studios may be grateful for the extra income in the current downturn?
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From reading the DPS web site it seems they already arrange studio days.
 
What about regional reps on the committee? Use the magazine as a tool for candidates to stand and canvass, as well as hold a vote through it.

Then, each regional rep gets a say on the committee and can be responsible for ensuring a couple of events get run in thier region each year.

Regional reps would also mean that the issue of an area biased committee would be addressed and resolved too.
 
Jan said:
Yup they do Keith but nearly always 'darn sarf' not a lot of use when you live in North Yorkshire!!
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Well that is something that would need to be addressed then.

It would be interesting to know what the demographics are of the DPS
 
I am at last relieved to see that the people on the forum ARE coming around to the way of thinking of the people who origonally 'kicked off' about the closure of the studio , all the coments just made is exactly what we wanted in the first place ......A society that were working for the good of the membership.
The whole point was not just the closure but the way it had all been done.

There is a deffinate lack of understanding as to the opinions of the general membership and it needs pulling up.
I wish Jan and John all the luck in rejoining the DPS , hopefully they would get the acknowledgements they seek
 
We don't seek any acknowledgement Dizzt Blonde, I felt very strongly that someone ought to speak up for the members of the DPS as some of them were very reluctant to get involved for obvious reasons and being a believer in freedom of speech I decided to take it upon myself.
I'm glad things seem to be calming down, hopefully lessons have been learned for the future, and those lessons have been absorbed by everyone and there'll not be a re-occurrence of this type of thing.
We still haven't decided whether to rejoin the DPS but notice on their website that they do have a planned studio day in York which is almost local and one in Derbyshire which is not too far away.. so there is hope in the future that everyone can be accommodated as they deserve to be
 
This saga has made the pages of Armature Photographer.

The Disabled Photographers' Society (DPS) is taking legal advice after a row that erupted following its controversial decision to close its national studio.

The society shut down the studio, which is based in Bristol, telling AP that it cost £6,000 a year to run and was used by a 'disproportionately small' number of its 500 members.

Acting chairman Tom Molloy said the studio brought in just £1,000 a year, a situation he described as unsustainable and one that put the 'future of the society in jeopardy'.

'In the current financial climate, like all charities we are suffering. The studio was not financially viable… It would have made us bankrupt,' said Molloy, who claims that only around 15 members used it.......
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...... Betty Billingham, former editor of the society's magazine, told us that the DPS was in a better financial state than it had been for years.

'Shirley [the former chairman] had hoped that, given a bit more time, this studio would have been the forerunner of others in different parts of the country where volunteers to run it could be found,' she said.

One angry member, who says he worked as a volunteer for the society, wrote on a photography forum last month. 'It is clear that the so-called board have no intention of pushing the DPS forward as they have literally obliterated the Bristol studio and its members, of which many have been left heartbroken by the decision.' ......
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....In a statement the society said: 'It was decided that the most cost-effective option would be to run studio days for DPS members in various locations around the country, utilising local facilities and that this would be a more cost-effective way of helping an even greater number of our members.'.....
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Full story HERE
 
The DPS is now consulting lawyers following comments about the society, which it claims may be libellous, made on external internet forums following its decision to close the studio.



Interesting - Mods have you heard anything yet? Mountain out of a molehill - I didn't think there was anything libellous on here?
 
I guess we don't know what others have said on other forums either, it may not just be on here.
(merely a suggestion, I'm not accusing ANYONE, just making a point for consideration!!)

My previous comment was made as a suggestion to enhance the DPS but it seems to have been glossed over so the arguing can continue :bang:

Time for bed for this thread?
 
Missed that one completely. Is Pete aware he has been quoted?
 
Nice of them to ask us if they could quote TP content :p
 
I know from my previous occupation that anything placed on the web, goes into the public domain, and from my own experience I don't think that they would need permission to use it. May be wrong..
 
Jan said:
I know from my previous occupation that anything placed on the web, goes into the public domain, and from my own experience I don't think that they would need permission to use it. May be wrong..
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Not so, anything written on the Internet is still copyright the author
 
Blimey what a mess:eek:, interesting thread though. Lets hope some good comes from this, and disabled togs can get back into a studio.
 
Well this goes in a different direction doesn't it.

One interesting thing, the letter sent to all DPS members quoting the Birstol members as "carpet baggers" - that is a term used when people try to take over the funds of organization often illegally was posted on the DPS website it has now gone, there certainly were comments in that letter which some would conside libel.

Jan, what people in Bristol wanted was for this issue to be discussed at the planned AGM, that was canceled, this society could have waited at least until the end of July, the rent was paid in advance on the studio until then before closing it. If that had happened and the membership had been told in advance the issue would be discussed at that AGM then if it were decided to close the studio this matter would have had to close. the problem here is that the membership are not being aloud a say on the issue, Tom Molloy was challenged on here to allow a thread on the DPS forum website for this to be discussed, he failed to respond to that challenge. If the DPS membership want this issue openly discussed then they should perhaps take one of the following actions:-

Write to their committee members.
Request the issue to be added to the agenda of the AGM in July.
Attend the AGM in July.
Ask that a thread is opened on the DPS website where this issue can be openly discussed by as many members of the society as possible.

To date I am told the constitutional method used by the DPS to discuss this issue is through the quarterly magazine, where is the average members voice in this process?

Jan, challenge Tom Molloy to open a thread, perhaps you will have more success than I.

Chris
 
Densley said:
Well this goes in a different direction doesn't it.

One interesting thing, the letter sent to all DPS members quoting the Birstol members as "carpet baggers" - that is a term used when people try to take over the funds of organization often illegally was posted on the DPS website it has now gone, there certainly were comments in that letter which some would conside libel.

Jan, what people in Bristol wanted was for this issue to be discussed at the planned AGM, that was canceled, this society could have waited at least until the end of July, the rent was paid in advance on the studio until then before closing it. If that had happened and the membership had been told in advance the issue would be discussed at that AGM then if it were decided to close the studio this matter would have had to close. the problem here is that the membership are not being aloud a say on the issue, Tom Molloy was challenged on here to allow a thread on the DPS forum website for this to be discussed, he failed to respond to that challenge. If the DPS membership want this issue openly discussed then they should perhaps take one of the following actions:-

Write to their committee members.
Request the issue to be added to the agenda of the AGM in July.
Attend the AGM in July.
Ask that a thread is opened on the DPS website where this issue can be openly discussed by as many members of the society as possible.

To date I am told the constitutional method used by the DPS to discuss this issue is through the quarterly magazine, where is the average members voice in this process?

Jan, challenge Tom Molloy to open a thread, perhaps you will have more success than I.

Chris
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I'm not going to challenge Tom Molloy to anything. Those who know me well know that it no-one tells me what to do I am my own master and it only makes me dig my heels in further! I'm sure he has the mentality to bring himself to this forum and start a thread if he wished to do that, and indeed I seem to think he's already been here and left a posting

Perhaps you should do as I suggested before and stop bickering, stop going backwards which is doing nothing to help the facts which we are all fully familiar with by now. What happened cannot be altered no matter how much you hated it and now you need to 'mop up' the mess as it were.

Obviously the magazine is a good way of finding members views, every member receives a copy of it and they are then all at liberty to say exactly what they think in just the same way as national magazines hold reader polls .. it works very well as does online polling.

As I keep saying the best way is to go forward from here and rebuild.

I did incidentally, say in a posting earlier that I had just noticed on the DPS website that there were studio days in York and Chesterfield. I hadn't read that bit before...
 
I think they should build me a studio in Harrogate and then one in Scotland for when i am away on my hols I DO FEEL LEfT OUT POOR ME, SOB SOB THEY DONT LOVE ME ANY MORE.
Grow up Please.
 
Don't make me close this thread please. We are keeping this open to allow everyone to have a fair platform for a voice to discuss the issues and how all the DPS members etc can move forward.

We are not to be used as a platform to be bitching, moaning and sneering at each other. Do that in your own time please.

Either serious grownup discussion ensues, or we'll be forced to close the thread.

Thanks.
 
Sorry about that but I am a member of the DPS and I think I have a right to know how my money is used when member from the North will not get the chance to use it, I think its one sided there must be more people from the North feel the same.
I know there are but they dont want to get involved.
 
J.R.Abbott said:
Sorry about that but I am a member of the DPS and I think I have a right to know how my money is used when member from the North will not get the chance to use it, I think its one sided there must be more people from the North feel the same.
I know there are but they dont want to get involved.
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Which brings me back to my earlier suggestion about setting up regional reps on the committee..........
 
I think its an exallent idea, unfortunatly I have heard that the DPS are againt it?
if anyone knows any different please let us know
 
J R who wrote the original post is, as you may realise, my husband, John but he's had to go to bed with migraine, so I'll just say that I know he is in the middle of composing a letter to the DPS making various suggestions, and this is one of them, so until he hears back from them we don't know the answer. Sorry!
 
fabs said:
I do hope that this forum isn't being used as an arena for a fight just because it can't be done on the DPS forum. I do know how much this all means to you guys, I'm disabled myself but this seems to be degenerating into mud slinging and name calling now. :(
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Seems that you've taken the words right out of my mouth. I'm just starting to look at photography as a hobby, and I too am disabled, but I'd never heard of the DPS until I found this thread. Hardly a good introduction, was it?

All of this seems to me to be down to poor communication - on all sides. The decision to close the studio may or may not have been taken for sound reasons - I don't know. For a small charity sometimes such tough decisions do have to be made and members are going to be unhappy as a result.

However, if reports in this thread are to be believed, it seems the charity has split into factions with the two sides sniping at each other. That's no way to run a charity. Sorry if I tread on any toes but charity is by definition for the benefit of those who it was set up to support - and that means all of them, and not as a personal 'plaything' for whichever faction is in charge at the time.

I hope this can be sorted out, for the benefit of all. I'd even like to be given the opportunity to join in, but not until the charity has put its own house in order.
 
Hi All,

Perhaps what is needed is a charity split into regions, JR/Rob a variation on your view, effectively the charity becomes a sort of federation, and each region could then develop services within its area but acting within the broader context of the aims and objectives of the society. What would be needed here though would be a complete rewrite of the constitution of the DPS. I understand there has been a difficulty with this in the past when it has been attempted, that isn’t by the way a criticism of the DPS.

Mark hi, welcome to the hobby, I would apologise that you have learnt of the DPS through this post, not the best of introductions to it! Strangely, I would still encourage you to join the DPS, there is much to commend it to you, this isn’t a new statement for me, my early experiences of the group were very good and it certainly has helped develop my photography in areas I used to find quite difficult. You will also find photography within its forums and galleries of a very high standard; you might like to contribute to those.

Migraine, hum know a little about that! Let’s talk more about the regional idea, but please those from the DPS sitting outside reading this thread, could you come and join in that conversation.

Chris
 
thank you Mark for your sensible comments, lets hope one day this all becomes sorted out and the DPS can get on the right tracks again.
 
Densley said:
.....JR/Rob a variation on your view, effectively the charity becomes a sort of federation, and each region could then develop services within its area but acting within the broader context of the aims and objectives of the society. What would be needed here though would be a complete rewrite of the constitution of the DPS. I understand there has been a difficulty with this in the past when it has been attempted, that isn’t by the way a criticism of the DPS.
......
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Take a look at the Scout Association structure. Whats they are one body they run as several different registered charities.

HQ > Region > County > District > Group is the breakdown. All run by HQ through a document called POR, Policy, Organisation and Rules. It works very well.
 
Rob Hi

Thanks will do that. I used to belong to St. John Ambulance who, then and I still believe now run on a HQ > County > Area > Division basis. The Divisions had their own management group (my term) which managed the day to day running but then participated back through the structure of areas county etc. There was a national rule book but counties/areas and even divisions could develop how they worked taking account of the broader national rules. An example an area could decide that ALL vehicles were under their direct control, yet a adjacent area in another county could decide that divisions could run vehicles, I believe now that HQ insist on the livery, standard of equipment and minimum training of staff but those running the vehicles could decide on a higher standard of say training or equiping. Essentially HQ lay down the minimum but others can set higher standards. If anyone is in SJA and I have it wrong please correct me.

In a way that sort of structure could work here, The DPS sets a minimum product structure, registration of staff, health and safety policy etc effectively its brand, but, getting back to the basis of this discussion, if the South West Region decided to add further services, like the studio it would have to fund that and make sure it did not become a drain on the National organisations resources. Things like the magazine, the forum and galleries would remain in the control of the national HQ, but obviously drawing on local resources.

From the DPS perspective, although that might bring all sides back together they would probably have problems accepting that model under their current constitution as it would not allow a large variation in what regions could provided.

Chris
 
Morning all, nice sunny day up here in Yorkshire..
John's written to the DPS to ask their views on all this.
So will report back when we hear from them. Don't give up on the DPS Mark, they are really a very worthwhile society and it's unfortunate that you've seen the worst side of it before the best.
I should have a look at their website It's interesting and helpful
 
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