More new film on the way

s162216 said:
Have those who gave money to Film Ferrenia's kickstarter been keeping up to date with their progress? They've certainly made a lot of important steps lately, and got much closer to their end goal.

http://www.filmferrania.it/news/
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Considering the problems they've faced I think they're doing an amazing job, delivery is getting really close now.
 
Email today offering an exchange for a black and white film, or keep original rewards and get discount on the black and white 80 ISO film in 135. I've opted for the latter!
 
ChrisR said:
Email today offering an exchange for a black and white film, or keep original rewards and get discount on the black and white 80 ISO film in 135. I've opted for the latter!
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Same here. :)

I've just been looking at their website, Ferrania P30 is back in an alpha run (i.e. early production, may produce inconsistent results with some scratches) and some of the samples on that link are gorgeous. I'm supposed to be selling film, not buying more, dammit! :confused:
 
I've opted to keep my original award too, but will probably buy a few rolls of P30 when they become available. Looking forward to getting an enamel pin as well :D
 
I'm keeping my original award, don't see the point of changing at this late stage.
 
This popped up in my facebook feed (I think that's what the cool kids call it) - Ferrania P30 First Tests.

Only a couple of sample images but I really like that it seems to develop well in Rodinal when standing it. I think getting usable results from a relatively fuss-free method will be key to getting wider use of the film.
 
ChrisR said:
Holy thread revival I know, but I've just spotted the Indiegogo campaign for CineStill 120 (800T), up to $45K in less than a day (target $120K). I was wondering about it, but they don't specify what shipping costs...
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Just found a post from Film Photography London showing shots from his first roll taken with CineStill 800T, ignoring the advice he was given. Not sure if the results are truly awful or weirdly appealing...
 
Anyone been able to order their P30 today? I've received the code but no-one's home! It appears they are a mite over-loaded...
 
Looks like the shop is working again. I've logged in and had a look, but I think I'm going to hold off for the time being. The voucher is for €5 per roll, but once you add VAT and postage (€14!), it works out at €44.50 for five rolls (~£39, £7.80 each).
 
Carl Hall said:
Looks like the shop is working again. I've logged in and had a look, but I think I'm going to hold off for the time being. The voucher is for €5 per roll, but once you add VAT and postage (€14!), it works out at €44.50 for five rolls (~£39, £7.80 each).
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Ouch! I suppose in time it will find its way to other outlets that might have more reasonable postage charges, or that can be amortised across a wider range of stock. Perhaps the Oxford meeters should chip in for a roll each?
 
ChrisR said:
Ouch! I suppose in time it will find its way to other outlets that might have more reasonable postage charges, or that can be amortised across a wider range of stock. Perhaps the Oxford meeters should chip in for a roll each?
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I thought that but it won't be in stock in time for oxford. maybe the Cornwall meet.
 
I saw on twitter a pic of 5 rolls of P30 taken by someone who'd ordered it. Anyone here received any yet?
 
ChrisR said:
I saw on twitter a pic of 5 rolls of P30 taken by someone who'd ordered it. Anyone here received any yet?
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I have an invoice in the email a day or so ago, saying my pre-order has been paid. I think this means my 5 rolls of Ferrania P30 will be on their way Real Soon Now! Looking forward to this, although I don't have a plan for shooting them yet. At least the roll of FP4 in the B&W camera is nearly finished...
 
ChrisR said:
In the post today... [5 rolls of P30]

View attachment 106413

No expiry date on the film which is confusing... but then, it was ALPHA I suppose. Now, what to shoot?

Having just finished a roll of FP4 on "detail shots", I might shoot a first roll on similar subjects, and send them both to [be devved]...
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I did as suggested here, and had several phone calls with my favourite developer, who was very confused about the (lack of) available information. In the end he agreed to do the P30 by hand in a Paterson tank, 12 minutes in XTOL 1+1 at 20C. That was his best guess and I encouraged him to go for it (the only other XTOL hint in the Film Ferrania lab sheet was someone having done 17 minutes 1+3 in a Jobo). He definitely doesn't want to be known as the lab that can develop P30, as this is way too manual a process. I shot at 80 as recommended; he said he thought it looked as if I should have shot at 64 or perhaps 50.

So I have the scans now, but not the negatives for another couple of days. A couple of them are quite nice, though none have come out as I might have expected, and none have come out anywhere near the FP4 shots, where there were similar shots (they were done on different days, so different conditions). Generally they look very low key, but then highlights can look super bright. I'll put some shots up later when I've had more of a think about them.
 
I'm a bit out of the loop about P30, I know it was offered by the Film Ferrania folk as an interim film before getting their new film up and running but what makes it need special hand processing?
 
RaglanSurf said:
I'm a bit out of the loop about P30, I know it was offered by the Film Ferrania folk as an interim film before getting their new film up and running but what makes it need special hand processing?
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I assumed it was because there were limited development data available regarding developers and times, as it is such a new emulsion, but I could be wrong.
 
RaglanSurf said:
I'm a bit out of the loop about P30, I know it was offered by the Film Ferrania folk as an interim film before getting their new film up and running but what makes it need special hand processing?
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skysh4rk said:
I assumed it was because there were limited development data available regarding developers and times, as it is such a new emulsion, but I could be wrong.
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This, I think. See http://www.filmferrania.it/p30/ . It's a high silver film, based on an old cinema emulsion. Processing information is here. If you have a look there, some people have added examples of their images. It seems to be quite high contrast, in an odd way. I can't be sure if I'm metering it all wrong, but a lot of medium tones seem quite dark, then the lighter tones suddenly very light. I'll put up some shots later.
 
ChrisR said:
This, I think. See http://www.filmferrania.it/p30/ . It's a high silver film, based on an old cinema emulsion. Processing information is here. If you have a look there, some people have added examples of their images. It seems to be quite high contrast, in an odd way. I can't be sure if I'm metering it all wrong, but a lot of medium tones seem quite dark, then the lighter tones suddenly very light. I'll put up some shots later.
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Sounds like a candidate for stand or semi-stand developing. This is probably one of the ocassions where it is benefitial to do your own developing.

Want to try putting it through PyroCat? That might help tame the highlights a bit.
 
Here are some of the better ones. All taken at 80 ISO with a Pentax MX and Pentax-M 50mm f/1.4 with an orange filter.

1) Bench in Kenilworth Castle
P30-0032 by Chris R, on Flickr

2) Girl in the Keep
P30-0034 by Chris R, on Flickr

3) Steps to view point
P30-0007 by Chris R, on Flickr

4) Antechamber to the Keep
P30-0005 by Chris R, on Flickr

5) House name
P30-0036 by Chris R, on Flickr

Definitely a dark and sombre mood to them!
 
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ChrisR said:
Here are some of the better ones. All taken at 80 ISO with a Pentax MX and Pentax-M 50mm f/1.4 with an orange filter.

1) Bench in Kenilworth Castle
P30-0032 by Chris R, on Flickr

2) Girl in the Keep
P30-0034 by Chris R, on Flickr

3) Steps to view point
P30-0007 by Chris R, on Flickr

4) Antechamber to the Keep
P30-0005 by Chris R, on Flickr

5) House name
P30-0036 by Chris R, on Flickr

Definitely a dark and sombre mood to them!
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They're a bit... sooty. Can't think of a better description, from the description of the film I'd expect a bit more punch. I think they're underdeveloped but my eye for developing issues is a bit rusty.
 
RumpFace said:
I'd like to know what it is too. Same goes with the ferrania stuff on another thread on here.
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As said in the other thread, P30 is their own new film, a modern "recreation" of an older Ferrania cinema stock. I'm guessing you haven't had any in for processing yet, then?

It rather looks like I was the only F&C person to have bought this!
 
Speaking of new film. I saw Bellamy Hunt announced today that JCH Streetpan 400 is available for pre-order in 120 now. I haven't been onto his store to find out delivery dates yet but I'm keen to order some seeing as I screwed up the development of the one roll of 35mm Streetpan I've shot, so will never know what it was like!
 
stevelmx5 said:
Speaking of new film. I saw Bellamy Hunt announced today that JCH Streetpan 400 is available for pre-order in 120 now. I haven't been onto his store to find out delivery dates yet but I'm keen to order some seeing as I screwed up the development of the one roll of 35mm Streetpan I've shot, so will never know what it was like!
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Wasn't that one something Like Rollei Retro re-badged?
 
So, I said I had some comparison shots done on FP4+ and P30. There are some real limitations however; although the camera and lens were the same (Pentax MX, Pentax-M 50mm f/1.4, orange filter) and both were shot at box speed, the light was different, and they were several days apart and at different times of day. These are all files "straight off the scanner" as received from the same lab (who doesn't want to be named as P30 was way too manual to take on at this time); no PP other than re-sizing and saving. In each case, the FP4 version comes first, followed by the P30 version.

a) Fountain in Kenilworth Castle Elizabethan Garden. Poor choice of angle in the P30 shot, and not surprising the Keep shows so dark given the metering was against the sky. I am a bit surprised at the sky in the P30 example (second); I would have said the sky was similar to the FP4 case, although I did not note it at the time.

Fountain FP4 P30 1.jpg
Fountain FP4 P30 2.jpg

b) Chain. I had completely forgotten where my point of focus (and aperture) was when I came to shoot the P30 example.

Chain FP4 P30 1.jpg

Chain FP4 P30 2.jpg

EDIT: While I am happy to accept that some of the differences will be metering mistakes made by me, I can't see why that would be likely in this case.

I'll add the other examples to a second post...
 
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c) Post with cycle locks. I have no idea why this one appeared so dark in the P30 version

Locks FP4 P30 1.jpg

Locks FP4 P30 2.jpg

d) Old graffiti. Joel Churchill from 1844, I've no doubt you're still feeling the fires of hell for your misdemeanour! That said, the look on this pair is pretty similar, at last...

Old graffiti FP4 P30 1.jpg

Old graffiti FP4 P30 2.jpg

Remember that in each case the FP4 image comes first, followed by the P30 image. All "straight off the scanner" with no PP other than resizing.
 
I've not had any yet but it'd be nice to have an idea for when i do.
I think the jch is rollei retro or something similar, you can't tear it, looks like it and it smells and feels like the rollei.
Can you tear the leader one the ferrania?
We tear the film from the bobbin and at the leader to get them clipped up to go on the machines see.
 
RumpFace said:
I've not had any yet but it'd be nice to have an idea for when i do.
I think the jch is rollei retro or something similar, you can't tear it, looks like it and it smells and feels like the rollei.
Can you tear the leader one the ferrania?
We tear the film from the bobbin and at the leader to get them clipped up to go on the machines see.
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I was not expecting to be able to tear it, but I could. I had problems with Rollei Retro (or Superpan) in the Rondinax tank; the guillotine couldn't cut it and I had to open it in darkness and cut with scissors. Both those films have a polyester base, which I now avoid. It doesn't say so, but P30 must have an acetate base.

@AgPhotographic are named on the site as a lab that has worked with Ferrania on P30; I hadn't spotted that before.
 
Final post in this set of comparisons... I got the negatives back today, and I must say many of the P30 shots look very under-exposed (or under-developed, I don't know how to tell the difference). I put the strips of negative containing the lock shot together on the scanner (just an A4 normal scanner), just for comparison FP4 on the left, P30 on the right):

Negatives copy.jpg

I'm at rather a loss to explain quite what's going on here. As you can see, some frames are severely under-exposed, some appear not too far off. The frame numbers on the P30 are perhaps a little faint, but clearly readable. The two graffiti shots appear similar density, but in other shots the P30 has almost no image.
 
I couldn't find any information on the colour sensitisation of P30, but this review says that it "leans towards the orthochromatic: dark red objects like London telephone boxes and buses go dark". If so, I'd expect your orange filter to have a greater effect on P30 than on FP4 and require more exposure as the filter would block more of the light.
 
steveo_mcg said:
Sounds like a candidate for stand or semi-stand developing. This is probably one of the ocassions where it is benefitial to do your own developing.

Want to try putting it through PyroCat? That might help tame the highlights a bit.
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I had a look through some of the examples. Most were devved in D-76, there were a few in Rodinal/R09, stand or semi-stand. AG use Fuji Negastar, which supposedly complements it. There was at least one example of Pyrocat HD. All the examples look very nice, but presumably selected as such.

StephenM said:
I couldn't find any information on the colour sensitisation of P30, but this review says that it "leans towards the orthochromatic: dark red objects like London telephone boxes and buses go dark". If so, I'd expect your orange filter to have a greater effect on P30 than on FP4 and require more exposure as the filter would block more of the light.
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Thanks Stephen, that's an interesting read. I suppose panchromatic verging towards orthochromatic is consistent with the film being ALPHA!. I wonder if this could explain some of the results. The green of the leaves behind the locks post would be reduced by the orange filter (in both cases) but if the P30 was relatively insensitive as well there would be a double effect. Not sure it explains the graffiti pics being about the same; the stone is red sandstone, so should have come through relatively bright but one would then assume the ortho effect would have made the P30 darker. Aaarggh it's doing me'ead'in!

I suppose the next roll had better be shot without the filter. I was wondering if I should shoot the next roll in two halves, and try to dev (in Ilfosol 3, which is what I've got) at different times. Not sure I've got enough control of the winding into the Rondinax though. Then I thought I should shoot the first part of each half at 80 and the second half at 50... I'm getting too complicated, aren't I!
 
ChrisR said:
Not sure it explains the graffiti pics being about the same; the stone is red sandstone, so should have come through relatively bright but one would then assume the ortho effect would have made the P30 darker.
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I don't offer this as an explanation, more a "something to bear in mind". The amount of light held back will depend not only on the colour of the object (few objects are actually monochromatic) but the colour of the light as well. There will be a greater proportion of red light at the beginning and end of the day in the sunlight, and when sunlight is reduced, skylight (from a blue sky) will be blue. Depending on the sensitivity of your meter, you may find an inconsistency, in that red filters (how red is your orange?) can fool meters into underexposing and it's usually suggested adding a stop for a red filter even with TTL metering.

Edit to add:
You really need an Exakta camera with cassette to cassette take up option and a built in cutting knife so you can expose just a few frames at a time. :D
 
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StephenM said:
I don't offer this as an explanation, more a "something to bear in mind". The amount of light held back will depend not only on the colour of the object (few objects are actually monochromatic) but the colour of the light as well. There will be a greater proportion of red light at the beginning and end of the day in the sunlight, and when sunlight is reduced, skylight (from a blue sky) will be blue. Depending on the sensitivity of your meter, you may find an inconsistency, in that red filters (how red is your orange?) can fool meters into underexposing and it's usually suggested adding a stop for a red filter even with TTL metering.

Edit to add:
You really need an Exakta camera with cassette to cassette take up option and a built in cutting knife so you can expose just a few frames at a time. :D
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Thanks Stephen. It looks pretty orange, but a lot less red than red! It's a Hoya O(G) whatever that means (discontinued, apparently)!
 
ChrisR said:
Thanks Stephen. It looks pretty orange, but a lot less red than red! It's a Hoya O(G) whatever that means (discontinued, apparently)!
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Obsolete(Gone) at a guess.
 
I took a roll of FP4+ in one Pentax MX, and a roll of P30 in another MX, rated at 125 and 80 respectively, both with 50mm lenses. For the first couple of shots the shutter speeds were the same and the aperture different, but then I increased the shutter speed of the FP4 camera by one stop, figuring that would be approximately right. I kept notes on the exposures with Evernote, for the first half of them film, before I got fed up. Both cameras were metered the same. I decided to send both films to AG Photolab, since apparently they have experience with the P30 (the review that someone pointed to above also used AG). Today I got the negatives back. My immediate thought is that the P30 is well under-exposed compared with the FP4. I did drop the negative sheets onto the A4 scanner, but the result doesn't show the difference as much as my eyes do.

I'll be scanning the negatives later. I'm guessing it's likely the scanning process will compensate for some of the exposure difference (as printing used to do). I'd like to scan at least a couple of frames with exactly the same parameters. Anyone know how to do that with Vuescan Pro?
 
h'mm P30 well under exposed? so that would mean the P30 ISO setting should be 25? OR the other MX's meter is out?
 
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