On1 RAW - what are your thoughts?

JohnN

JohnN

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John
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*** BEFORE FALLING FOR ANY HYPE READ THE BELOW ***
(Edit post release)

This one slipped under my radar for a while - probably as its not out yet - heres a link (link).

I've already got Lightroom CC and am fair at using it, but still always nice to see something new to shake things up a bit.

Pop over to the link and take a look, the speed if nothing else looks very good - good to see non-destructive and layers in the same things, without all the extra additions of photoshop.

 
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They keep sending me emails to pre--order it. Not on you life!!!!!

I bought On 1 at version 9 and it was terribly slow and clunky. Kept freezing and crashing out after a couple of effects. I was in contact with support and fixes were promised but never materialised.
They they bought out v10 and wanted me to pay again for an upgrade even though I'd only had v9 for 3-4 months and it never worked property. I complained bitterly and eventually they gave me the upgrade for free.
v10 was better by in my opinion has still not a polished application. Still buggy and still crashes now and then. It's not particularly fast even though their blurb bragged about how fast it was.
If using their browser my CPU usage sky rockets and my fans go crazy and I'm not even doing anything other than browsing a folder of images. I emailed them and they told me it's because it was scanning the entire HDD for images. So essentially my work is slowed down because their software is scanning for images in folders that I'm not even in?????

I will probably look at On1 Raw but to be honest I'm not holding out much hope and I imagine (especially as it is their first release) will be buggy as hell, they'll patch a few things here and there and then charge you another £100 next year for an upgrade.
 
•


John,

this is not THE only RAW converter integrated to a pixel editor
as, if you are on MAC, UK made Affinity Photo does it too (the
PC version will be available this fall!)

This is all fine but there many big problem,
  • the RAW adjustments are not readable by all apps and the work done
    will have to be redone. So my suggestion is to work with a RAW app
    that makes sense to you (I use Capture One Pro) for     constant work and
    then work in a pixel editor.
  • OnOne's proximity to Adobe products means it must support integration
    in the plug-ins (and others) and this will not grant snappy performance
ecoleman said:
They keep sending me emails to pre--order it
Click to expand...
Here too but my mind is set since 5 years on Capture One Pro and Affinity Photo
since a year. The marriage works just fine… the Danes and the Brits are doing
just great! Of OnOne's Photo Suite softwares, I will need only their RESIZE app.
 
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For me its about the least number of steps - my workflow (such as it is) is:
  1. open lightroom
  2. import directly (it does the folder sorting and copy)
  3. grade the images and purge in a pass or two
  4. edit images
  5. flag, tag then publish from within lightroom (or export if needed for something else)
Nothing more unless I need to faf about in something like Silver Efex or the like as I hate creating multiple versions of the same file over and over, its inefficient on many levels.

Personally I've never liked the RAW editors that come with cameras, its just another step I don't want or need.
 
I've had perfect effects 9 for some time, but not used it in anger, have also got 8 and tend to still go to that, downloaded onone 10 last week, still not had much chance to try it out though, not sure about the RAW converter they keep sending me emails for either.

@Kodiak how to you find Affinity in comparison to PS, I have just seen they have a Beta version for Windows which I am trying to download as I type, with not much success I might add, it does look interesting though, and a third of the price of PS
 
Been happy using both Lightroom for dev and On1 suite since version 7.5 for pixel editing and effects. Version 10 is fine, but I can't seen a benefit to RAW over lightroom, and there will be disadvantages who use other raw editors & cataloguing software since there will now be 2 separate catalogues. As said already, the browse package isn't fast, and tags added in there don't always make it through to lightroom, making it a waste of time.

I will not upgrade this time round.
 
I think the point of on1 raw is that despite what they say it's a replacement for lightroom, having a faster use anywhere (including network drive) catalogue, but also having their suite built in and nondestructive.

The browse speed in their videos is certainly faster than my lightroom (they may be using better hardware), not that mines that slow, so their challenge then is to make their suite be able to beat lightroom in speed, accessibility and end result, after that with their suite on top and what appears to be a compatible system for plugins they could be on to a winner.

I can see the appeal in being able to work on images on a network as that reduces the amount of storage needed if you have a setup like mine, that being images on local drive (or lightroom\editing) which are then backed up to the network which is on a raid for further redundancy. In theory it could work with something like Dropbox or Google drive where it's automatically backed up off site. All that's required then is it back up the catalogue itself.
 
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JohnN said:
I think the point of on1 raw is that despite what they say it's a replacement for lightroom, having a faster use anywhere (including network drive) catalogue, but also having their suite built in and nondestructive.

The browse speed in their videos is certainly faster than my lightroom (they may be using better hardware), not that mines that slow, so their challenge then is to make their suite be able to beat lightroom in speed, accessibility and end result, after that with their suite on top and what appears to be a compatible system for plugins they could be on to a winner.

I can see the appeal in being able to work on images on a network as that reduces the amount of storage needed if you have a setup like mine, that being images on local drive (or lightroom\editing) which are then backed up to the network which is on a raid for further redundancy. In theory it could work with something like Dropbox or Google drive where it's automatically backed up off site. All that's required then is it back up the catalogue itself.
Click to expand...

Last point first, that will only be viable if you have a super-fast internet connection, which is some time away for many UK users.

The browse speed in their videos has always appeared quick, but on my home system using i7 quad core, SSD and 16GB RAM (i.e. not slow) I cannot match it, and browse is not USEFULLY faster than Lightroom.

If I were a new user then it might be fine, but I don't want to change from a system that still works well after several years to an entirely new system. Now if the new RAW software can import LR catalogues with all editing intact then that's another matter, but I suspect not.

*edit*
Just to say that I do like On1 software and the things it does, but cannot see it easily becoming a viable replacement for LR.
 
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JohnN said:
I think the point of on1 raw is that despite what they say it's a replacement for lightroom, having a faster use anywhere (including network drive) catalogue, but also having their suite built in and nondestructive.

The browse speed in their videos is certainly faster than my lightroom (they may be using better hardware), not that mines that slow, so their challenge then is to make their suite be able to beat lightroom in speed, accessibility and end result, after that with their suite on top and what appears to be a compatible system for plugins they could be on to a winner.

I can see the appeal in being able to work on images on a network as that reduces the amount of storage needed if you have a setup like mine, that being images on local drive (or lightroom\editing) which are then backed up to the network which is on a raid for further redundancy. In theory it could work with something like Dropbox or Google drive where it's automatically backed up off site. All that's required then is it back up the catalogue itself.
Click to expand...

The one thing I've learnt over the past couple of years is NEVER, EVER believe On 1's speed claims.
I have the highest spec iMac going and On1 is by no means fast.
 
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TG. said:
how to you find Affinity in comparison to PS
Click to expand...
•


Affinity Photo, given time, will get to the potential of its
concurrent with the advantage of not having such a
heavy architecture that must maintain some "contact"
with older version and the extend of the Creative Suite.

With a fresh start, they have proven me that they are
a solid team of competent solution finding thinkers and
their apps are my choice. For my works, they offer alre-
dy all the tools I need though they are not yet using the
convenience of the contextual menus enough IMO…
but I'm sure they will get to it in a very near future.

I previously bought OnOne Perfect Photo Suite before
I knew Affinity and OnOne is no longer on my computers
but their Perfect Resize that is still, IMO, the best in the
industry. As for the rest, imagery is not my bag and they
suffer the same heavy architecture approach than Adobe
and, as it is known by now, I don't use any software from
that maker as third parties are very active, creative and
innovative.

I hope this answers well to your question. :)

ecoleman said:
To be fair to Affinity, their pixel edit is good… but honestly the Affinity Raw converter is Shyte.
Click to expand...

I agree with part one of this^, but for part two I cannot
comment as I am happy with in Capture One Pro.
 
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I think most of us with open minds are always willing to investigate and evaluate the potential of new methods of working.
As an OnOne owner (and only occasionally using the software) I too am being urged to pre-order their mooted raw developer.
However I'd be very reluctant to commit to actually purchasing same without the opportunity to evaluate it's performance first.
 
Well, now its out I downloaded the 30 day trial and for all I know it could be good, but its doesn't support XT-2 RAW files - XT-1 yes, but not 2 - so at the moment not a great deal of use to me.

I could have a play with the XT-1 or Nikon or Canon but why bother they failed at image number one.

I did have a quick play with the dynamic range and portrait effects but they were horribly overcooked and without supporting my current format I didn't have the impetus to see if I could apply these with just the brush as I would in lightroom.
 
Actually I put that in my report - five seconds to show thumbnails for a folder of 32 images - lightroom roughly two.

I think its a real shame and can only presume marketing got in the way of tech (yet again) and made them release early.
 
Well maybe I got pulled in by the hype, but I preordered it. I have used On1 10 a fair bit and I liked the look of it being faster as well as one or two other features. I also liked the idea of it not using a catalog and just being able to quickly resize a photo for instance, without having to import it. Mainly I use Lightroom CC. I enjoy playing with On1 for things like making birthday cards, more than straight photo editing.

JohnN said:
Actually I put that in my report - five seconds to show thumbnails for a folder of 32 images - lightroom roughly two.
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As yet I've not had a lot of chance to play with it and haven't got my head around how it works.

I've just opened it up to see how it was in the browser. It appeared to show thumbnails in a folder with over 200 raw files in less than a second to me. I didn't download the beta release - not sure if that has made a difference.
 
I've just had a quick play. Browsing and editing do seem a lot faster to me. It still takes a little while to export. I was using it directly, not via Lightroom, and only used the Browse and Fx modules. Maybe Layers is more problematic?
 
That's how I used it and only download two days ago and checked for an update, I wonder if the slowness was because it was the XT2 files, I'll have to check some XT1 or even something more mainstream
 
Ah, okay the speed is fine, better than fine in fact - near instant as said, once you realise that the first time it looks in a folder it makes an xmp file for each image - once you've been in a folder once its quick, the first time not so much so as its looking at each one and scraping data.

What I would like to see (apart from XT2 support) is a decent import like in Lightroom where it put everything in a folder based on camera etc.
 
JohnN said:
Ah, okay the speed is fine, better than fine in fact - near instant as said, once you realise that the first time it looks in a folder it makes an xmp file for each image - once you've been in a folder once its quick, the first time not so much so as its looking at each one and scraping data.
Click to expand...

It will be a little while before I can give this some attention, but I am a little confused. Mine doesn't produce an XMP once I've viewed a folder. Is this maybe something in settings? Just wondering what I am doing differently.

Also, this non-destructive thing... if I edit the RAW file, then I know I can reset it to go back to the original, but even so I can't see an XMP stored anywhere, and I can no longer see the original from ON1 RAW without either hitting Preview, or resetting it. Is there a way of creating a 'virtual' copy or equivalent?

I suppose I'll have to go through the myriad of instructional videos!
 
JohnN said:
Ah, okay the speed is fine, better than fine in fact - near instant as said, once you realise that the first time it looks in a folder it makes an xmp file for each image - once you've been in a folder once its quick, the first time not so much so as its looking at each one and scraping data.

What I would like to see (apart from XT2 support) is a decent import like in Lightroom where it put everything in a folder based on camera etc.
Click to expand...

But On1 made a very big deal about his quick it was browsing a folder of raw files without the need to generate previews (like LR)
The fact is it's no different. Once LR previews are generated it's just as quick.
 
Bebop said:
It will be a little while before I can give this some attention, but I am a little confused. Mine doesn't produce an XMP once I've viewed a folder. Is this maybe something in settings? Just wondering what I am doing differently.

Also, this non-destructive thing... if I edit the RAW file, then I know I can reset it to go back to the original, but even so I can't see an XMP stored anywhere, and I can no longer see the original from ON1 RAW without either hitting Preview, or resetting it. Is there a way of creating a 'virtual' copy or equivalent?

I suppose I'll have to go through the myriad of instructional videos!
Click to expand...

I'm not sure why ours would be different, I just pressed next a lot until finish during installation
 
ecoleman said:
But On1 made a very big deal about his quick it was browsing a folder of raw files without the need to generate previews (like LR)
The fact is it's no different. Once LR previews are generated it's just as quick.
Click to expand...
I think mine is operating differently from John's. If his is generating an XMP file when it first browses a folder that would slow it down. Mine doesn't do that and mine is really quick.
JohnN said:
I'm not sure why ours would be different, I just pressed next a lot until finish during installation
Click to expand...
I didn't pay too much attention when I was installing it either!
 
Just a thought, I'm on PC are you on mac?
 
I've just noticed in preferences you can choose to save sidecar files. Bizarrely mine seemed to be saving the edit information somewhere, but it could not be seen alongside the image in the same folder. On turning sidecars on, it leaves a .on1 file when you edit the photo. Still seems pretty quick and doesn't seem to be saving them for every photo when I browse a new folder .
View attachment 92349
 
I have been TRYING to use ON1 software since version 8. The software frequently crashes for no apparent reason and support has always been sadly lacking. Each time a new release came out I paid up hoping that this time it would be OK. I went over the top with specing my computer. I run the system on a 500 GByte Samsung SSD; have 16 GByte DDR3 RAM and a new compliant graphics card with 2 GByte RAM on board. NOTHING helps. I am at a point now where I can't even get beyond the crash notice without it crashing again. I don't know what the developers are doing all day, and on what spec machines they are doing it but it doesn't seem to be working. The marketing machine ticks along beautifully thankyou, but after that nobody seems to care. I pre-purchased way back in 2016. They scheduled ON1 Raw for a Fall release. Since when has fall been late December? I reckon they couldn't lie any longer and decided to release a flawed product again. The amount of productive time I have had with ON1 is next to nothing. I have wasted time and money hoping that someday they would get it right. Do not buy this product! It really is a piece of junk.It is not slick. It is not fast. It does not run!
I would like to add that I am also a Photoshop CC and Lightroom user. I have been with both products for some years now and never had problems with them (using a PC less powerful and capable than my present one). I am now at the point of asking ON1 for a refund or simply writing off my $89 and carrying on with PS and LR. Stay away from ON1 - it will bring you to tears!

TerryS
 
Go for the refund, plainly marketing have more pull than development so go for them.

My draw was the improved handling of Fuji RAW files, but so far not so good though in fairness I've not looked that hard given they only support the camera I'm selling.
 
@TerryS how did it work out, did you get anywhere?
 
Hi, Well Although TerryS above has made quite a long negative post about On1 I have to say I agree with him!! I have been trying to get the software to work without crashing since Perfect Photo Suite 9 Premium Upgrade 2014. After speaking to a rep who called me I have upgraded my system with SSD drives, New graphics card as Terry's 2GB, 16GB RAM, closed ALL other software and STILL it crashes, not right away but when you are altering an image and half way through the software just stops working it is more than a pain in the backside. I also have Lightroom and P/S CS6 and never had a problem. Anything good to say about On1? well yes!! after complaining about Suite 9 crashing I was given a FREE upgrade to 10 and when that just carried on as 9 I complained again and got a FREE upgrade to the On1 RAW software and after that carried on doing the same did I complain? NO!! just use P/S and L/R.
One last observation on On1. There constant (how should I say? Barrage of Emails) to get you to buy something you already have is also a pain in the backside.
Russ
 
Given yours and Terry's replies I have stuck a big red warning on the opening post as I don't want anyone to be out of pocket because I thought it had promise - especially as its not just the software they're making you fork out for but a whole new system - thats just shocking.
 
Im the other way around, Im coming from a very light use Lightroom background and Im absolutely loving the the new ON1 raw. true, it runs like a dog on my Macbook Pro, but on my Win 10 desktop with 2 screens and 32Gb of ram, it is buttery smooth and very quick and rock solid crash wise. Im spending time editing photo's whereas in lightroom it was rare, partly because of the whole catalogue format. Im a massive fan, I find it intuitive and fun to use and Im loving what I can now do with my photo's
 
Martin Macleod-Brown said:
Im the other way around, Im coming from a very light use Lightroom background and Im absolutely loving the the new ON1 raw. true, it runs like a dog on my Macbook Pro, but on my Win 10 desktop with 2 screens and 32Gb of ram, it is buttery smooth and very quick and rock solid crash wise. Im spending time editing photo's whereas in lightroom it was rare, partly because of the whole catalogue format. Im a massive fan, I find it intuitive and fun to use and Im loving what I can now do with my photo's
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A genuine question. How did the LR catalog format affect your editing in LR. I really dont get how people struggle with LR catalog. It's no different to any OS folder structure.
 
I'm not sure, that said I renewed my trial and for deleting old images it's pretty quick
 
Without aberration correction I'm not interested, this should be a standard option.
 
ecoleman said:
A genuine question. How did the LR catalog format affect your editing in LR. I really dont get how people struggle with LR catalog. It's no different to any OS folder structure.
Click to expand...

I found it completely counter intuitive to how I wanted to organise my photo's, I also hated the lack of network drive support, and I find ON1 more natural to use, in the 4 months I have owned it, I have edited more photo's than I have done in the 3yrs that I have had lightroom. Im also much more willing to experiment and ins the way the modules are organised more in tune with the way I think. All purely personal, but for me I no longer avoid editing photo's
 
ON1 also looks truely awful on 4k screens. The text overlaps and disappears above and below other areas. 4k resolution screens are becoming increasing popular and my new Dell XPs 15 laptop has one. In the end I've bit the bullet and gone the Photoshop CC route.
 
Organic said:
ON1 also looks truely awful on 4k screens. The text overlaps and disappears above and below other areas. 4k resolution screens are becoming increasing popular and my new Dell XPs 15 laptop has one. In the end I've bit the bullet and gone the Photoshop CC route.
Click to expand...

They certainly haven't got the text scaling right (on any screen size right now) and I'd certainly agree (XPS15 here too) but curiously I find that I still like the results with this software enough to continue to use it.
 
ancient_mariner said:
They certainly haven't got the text scaling right (on any screen size right now) and I'd certainly agree (XPS15 here too) but curiously I find that I still like the results with this software enough to continue to use it.
Click to expand...

It does look a great bit of software and I'm sure they'll sort it Toni. I'll probably take another look when my Adobe CC subrciption is due for renewal in 12 months time.
 
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